Jane Austen

I was wondering who here is a fan of Jane Austen. Has anyone read all of her books?

The only one I have read all the way through is Pride and Prejudice. I am ashamed to admit it too! I have seen the film versions of all her books, excepting Persuasion, and I adore them. I started reading Sense and Sensibility but have yet to finish it.

Does anyone else find themselves delighted to read Austen's words? She is witty and bright and it's wonderful to me because it's a woman's freedom in a time when women had little freedom.

I recently watched the movie The Jane Austen Book Club and it has sort of inspired me! In the film a small group of women and a man, totalling in 6, gather together once a month to discuss one of the 6 Jane Austen novels. Each person is responsible for leading the discussion of each book each month. So, it's a book a month for a total of 6 months. I wonder if anyone would be interested in doing that here!

I propose that we read a book a month, in order of publication, as noted above. We can then spend the following month discussing the book as we read the next. Anyone interested? Any other ideas? Please don't tell me I'm alone in desire to read more Austen!

Re: Jane Austen

Hello Miriamele !

I can´t say that I have read some of Jane Austens books,  but I love the films that are produced from her stories.  I must say that the BBC versions are closest to my heart.  Actually it is starting a BBC production of “Sense and sensibility” on norwegian television this evening, and I really look forward to it.  I love the scenery,  the clothes and the lovestories.  I also appreciated  “Pride and prejudice”  and especially the version with Colin Firth as Mr. Darcy.
,
I would love to read her books someday and I think you have a good idea to try to gather Jane Austen supporters to learn and discuss her literary work.  I wish you good luck with that project.

I would,  as a closing,  share some minutes from the BBC production of “Sense and sensibilty”

All the best
Ane

Re: Jane Austen

Ooon BBC is doing “Sense and Sensibility”?! I must get my  hands on that!! They're really good about releasing these things on dvd so I will have to keep my eye out. I wish I wasn't at work at the moment. They have youtube blocked. :( Oh well, I will check it out later! Thank you for the link!

If you're interested in reading any Austen you should join us! It'll be great!

Re: Jane Austen

Thank you Miriamele and Ane Lis for this wonderful spirited discussion on a wonderful writer and her works.  Ok Miriamele I am on, how about reading Jane Austen's works in the order you have listed there starting with Sense and Sensibilities.  I will start reading it and we can use this same thread in posting any ideas or epiphanies we encounter while reading Austen's novels. 
Have a great literary day everyone,
Samme

Re: Jane Austen

I'm interested in a discussion! I love Jane Austen. I think I've read all her books, certainly I've tried, and have seen several version of Pride and Prejudice. I have the video of Mansfield Park, very well done though rather free a version, and like the Sense and Sensibility I saw years ago.

So, I guess we would start with Sense and Sensibility? From the list below… (from the wikipedia article here)

How would you like to go about discussing it? When do we start? How many chapters per week?

This is fun! Thanks!

• Sense and Sensibility (1811)
• Pride and Prejudice (1813)
• Mansfield Park (1814)
• Emma (1815)
• Northanger Abbey (1817) (posthumous)
• Persuasion (1817) (posthumous)

Re: Jane Austen

Hurray thank you Nicole for answering to the idea of Miriamele.  I have all the books here ready and finally they are ready to be read.  LOL
Anybody can read as much as they want and then post your reflections anytime and post questions to so that we can be challenge to see things in different light. 
Onwards to Sense and Sensibilities. 

Re: Jane Austen

I think it may be best to do this in a little bit more organized a manner. Does everyone think they can read a book a month? Sometime life gets in the way. I know I can probably read much faster than that, but it's also so much fun to discuss as we read and I want to make sure to give everyone a chance to say something. I also think it would going against the whole idea of fun to be so structured.

How about we just check in every week and see where everyone else is? When we post we can make a “spoiler alert” and leave a gap before writing in order to warn readers. Mayhap you should notate which chapters you're referring to so that we will know. So “Spoilers through Chapter 21”, etc.

I wish we could turn our font white so that we can just highlight and read it. lol I don't know why but it's kinda neat to me. Anyway, what do you all think? Is a month sufficient? Also, I say we say “Sense and Sensibility” will be through September so that will give people a chance to hop on and catch up through the tail end of August!

Let me know what you all think! I can't wait to get home (at work right now) and crack open my copy of Sense and Sensibility! I think I may also start a new thread for discussion of each book. Good? Yes, no, maybe?

Re: Jane Austen - Sense & Sensibility - through September

I think it's a great idea to discuss S and S till the end of September. That will help maximise involvement.

Hugs!

Nicole

Re: Jane Austen - Sense & Sensibility Chapter One

Download e-book here for free

Chapter One
In the first chapter, Austen sets up the dichotomy between “Sense”, in the person of the eldest Dashwood daughter, Elinor, and “Sensibility” (feeling) in the person of the second daughter, Marianne:

Elinor, this eldest daughter, whose advice was so effectual, possessed a strength of
understanding, and coolness of judgment, which qualified her, though only nineteen, to be the counsellor of her mother, and enabled her frequently to counteract, to the advantage of them all, that eagerness of mind in Mrs. Dashwood which must generally have led to imprudence.

She had an excellent heart;—her disposition was affectionate, and her feelings were strong; but she knew how to govern them: it was a knowledge which her mother had yet to learn; and which one of her sisters had resolved never to be taught.

Marianne's abilities were, in many respects, quite equal to Elinor's. She was sensible and clever; but eager in everything: her sorrows, her joys, could have no moderation. She was generous, amiable, interesting: she was everything but prudent. The resemblance between her and her mother was strikingly great.

So right away we see that at the tender age of 19, Miss Sense is keeping her mother on the straight and narrow, since her mother like Marianne is Mrs Sensibility.

So the mother and Marianne, in the wake of the death of husband/father and the devastatingly disastrous bequests, encourage each other to greater paroxysms of griefs while Elinor tries to keep them on an even keel, making  them keep to the social niceties of being proper with the hateful sister-in-law and selfish brother.

What a different world it was, eh?

Comments on chapter one? Maybe we can keep this thread just for chapter one comments.

Samme, I hope I'm not being too much in charge here? Does this make sense to you?

Love,

Nicole

Re: Jane Austen - Chapter One

I see no reason for anyone to worry about you posting and taking charge. I think it's very helpful! I've never done a book club before so I could use help! : ) My only feedback is that when we do discussion just title the thread accordingly “Austen, Sense and Sensibility, Chapter One” or whatever. Plus anyone can just hop in at that point.

Oh man! I can't wait to hop in and get reading. *watches the clock*

Re: Jane Austen - Chapter One

Oooomg…it was like my eyes glazed over and I didn't see your link to read this online. *excited* I guess I can read before I get home after all!!

<3<3<3

I think I love you right now.

Re: Jane Austen - Sense & Sensibility Chapter One

Hey, Miriamele, I'm glad to have been of help! So, what did you think of Chapter One?

Love,

Nicole

Re: Jane Austen - Sense & Sensibility Chapter One

Nicole,

So far I love this book. I have read the first few chapers of S&S before and though I don't mean to demean our beloved Austen, I have to say that she is so wordy! I'm not one who opposes such things but it does make it a little hard to get into at first. One thing I love about regency period novels is how wordy and un-wieldy they can be. The entire first chapter, with the exception in explaining the nature of Elinor vs her Mother and Sisters, is about the financial straights of the family. She goes into detail that we would normally not care so much about today. So and so is allotted this much money, etc. It's interesting though because it is a study of history, isn't it? Matters like these were of the utmost importance, as women were really only able to respectfully thrive through their inheritance, as “working” was degrading.

Something we would ordinarily think is unnecessary is so important to women of that time. Though I sometimes sigh and want to skip past these matters I always remind myself that it is written for a reason and though it can be a little boring, it plays such an important part on the women in this book and the station of their lives.

The chapters are rather short though, aren't they? Mayhap we should do sections of 10 chapters. There are 50 chapters, correct? At this point we're doing about 5 weeks for this book, so we can do 10 chapters a week. The chapters aren't terribly long and it will help us space out each grouping. I find that 1 chapter was so short and I wanted to continue on and read more and discuss it, but if you haven't read it yet… spoilers ensue. So yeah, how does everyone else feel about that? That way if someone is perhaps a little slower to catch up due to scheduling or whatever else, they will still have a decent amount of time to get in.
You, or I, Nicole, if you want, can post a new thread focusing on each 10 chapter section in the main forum ? I wonder if I should check if this is okay? It just seems so much more organized this way. I am so anal though so please tell me to stop if I'm weird. lol I just worry about people getting ahead and… oh what am I saying? this is for fun isn't it? Anyway, I am about to go for a walk, but when I come back I will likely have more to say on the matter!

Again you guys, this is so awesome. At first I was worried no one would want to participate. I'm so glad I'm wrong!  : )

Jane Austen - Sense & Sensibility Chapters 1-10 - Spoilers!

Ok, Miri (hope you don't mind if I call you that, please tell me if you do!),

Let's do it in chunks of 10 chapters. Since we've already talked about chapter one as introducing some key issues, here's an overview for chapters 2-10 - if you don't want to know what will happen, don't read the below before you read the chapters.

I welcome any responses you have to anything in these chapters, whether introduced as theme or question below or not. Jump in!

Chapter 2 - this is a hilarious study in rationalisation and self-justification, as the Dashwood brother is readily and quickly persuaded to downgrade further and further his original generous impulse to give 1,000 pounds to each of his half-sisters from his unfairly large bequest. This is Austen at her most devastating in terms of human nature. The chapter finishes with this perfect summary:

This argument was irresistible. It gave to his intentions whatever of decision was wanting before; and he finally resolved, that it would be absolutely unnecessary, if not highly indecorous, to do more for the widow and children of his father, than such kind of neighbourly acts as his own wife pointed out.

Chapter 3 - in which we get better acquainted with the foibles of Mrs Dashwood (I find her very endearing, what do you think? Austen seems to love her in an exasperated sort of way :) ), we are introduced to Edward Ferrars, who, like many an Austen male foil for a female protagonist, comes across to modern sensibilities as rather insipid and dull. Certainly Marianne has no patience with him! :)

Chapter 4 - here we see the first detailed interaction between Elinor and Marianne, again underlining the character differences between them as well as their deep affection for each other and unwillingness to hurt or trouble each other. Again, idealised sisterhood seems to be a big theme in Austen novels. I don't know about you but I didn't have these kinds of warm fuzzies with my sisters growing up! We fought like cats and dogs. :)

Chapter 5 - after much discussion in the preceding chapters about the change in abode, the Dashwood family finally makes a move. I find it interesting what is taken for granted in terms of the most sensible and modest requirements (Elinor's advice of course) in terms of servants - “two maids and a man, with whom they were speedily provided from amongst those who had formed their establishment at Norland” :):) different times indeed! Two of these are sent ahead to prepare the home - again, for a family in such severe straits, all seems from our perspective to surround them with support. It's all relative, of course!

Chapter 6 - they settle into their new tiny home, Mrs Dashwood already dreaming of how she can expand it on no money, and are welcomed into their new neighbourhood by Sir John Middleton and Lady Middleton, again very familiar standard characters of the high born in Austen books, the man affable but silly and obsessed with the hunt, the woman cold and only concerned for herself and her spoiled children.

Chapter 7 - then follows the obligatory first visit to the Middleton's manor, and meeting with the next key character, Colonel Brandon. Austen signals his importance by emphasising how different he is from the Middletons, how sensible and gentlemanlike. The chapter closes with this assessment of him by Marianne which had me literally shouting out loud with laughter when I read it yesterday (at my extremely advanced age of 43!):

His pleasure in music, though it amounted not to that ecstatic delight which alone could sympathize with her own, was estimable when contrasted against the horrible insensibility of the others; and she was reasonable enough to allow that a man of five and thirty might well have outlived all acuteness of feeling and every exquisite power of enjoyment. She was perfectly disposed to make every allowance for the colonel's advanced state of life which humanity required.

:):):) Well, after all, she is only 17 years old! He looks to her to have one foot in the grave …

Chapter 8 - in which widow Jennings the busybody and matchmaker gets busy anticipating wedding bells for Marianne… and Marianne worries about why Ferrars has not yet visited Elinor.

Chapter 9 - finally! the significant and dramatic first meeting of Willoughby, hero-rescuer and Marianne.

Chapter 10 - Willoughby begins to ensconse himself. I find it interesting from a modern standpoint that at this late stage, Marianne for the first time is described physically, and how typical of the period is her description!

Miss Dashwood had a delicate complexion, regular features, and a remarkably pretty figure. Marianne was still handsomer. Her form, though not so correct as her sister's, in having the advantage of height, was more striking; and her face was so lovely, that when in the common cant of praise, she was called a beautiful girl, truth was less violently outraged than usually happens. Her skin was very brown, but, from its transparency, her complexion was uncommonly brilliant; her features were all good; her smile was sweet and attractive; and in her eyes, which were very dark, there was a life, a spirit, an eagerness, which could hardily be seen
without delight.

Ok, Miri, Sasha, Samme, anyone else, go for it! Comments, questions, thoughts…. anything?

Love,

Nicole

Re: Jane Austen - Sense & Sensibility Chapters 1-10 - Spoilers!

So I only got through the first 6 chapters so far. You know, it's always frustrating when you go to do something expecting you'll have lots of time and then it turns out that there's no time at all! Am I glad we're doing 10 chapters a week? Yes, yes I am! : )

I really adore the whole developing scene at Norland Park (Chapters 1-5). I think I really like it because of Austen's description of the family members. You can just imagine them and it's so amusing. First we have the brother, as Nicole already stated, lowering his benefits to his mother and sisters and justifying it to himself, as if they don't deserve it at all. It truly is human nature to disguise our less savory traits by stretched excuses, isn't it? You stated, Nicole, that Edward Ferras was a bit on the dull side, and while I agree, so is Elinore, isn't she? She really is a foil for her. I'm glad I know that Elinore really isn't. We get that in her discussion with Marianne regarding her feelings for Mr. Ferras. I love how she's like “We'll he's nice enough and if I knew he liked me a bit more than just friends than I might admit I care for him a bit more than that too.” It just makes me laugh because it's such a typical female avoidance thing. We always want to avoid exposing ourselves to avoid hurt. It's somewhat refreshing to know that our struggles are pretty timeless.

Marianne and her mother – man they crack me up. Marianne is such a headstrong teenager! She has ideals of passion and art in her brain. What do you want to bet that if she was born in the 90's she'd be off following some sexy musician around, town to town as he tours? And for Mama! Well, She is exuberant and a bit exasperating isn't she? I love her though - it's endearing. She is sad she has to leave her home and make a big scene about finding the perfect place to move and then the moment Mrs. John Dashwood is rude and implied Edward and Elinore cannot be she is so offended she must leave at once! She's pretty quick in her emotions, but it's nice to see that instead of being overly selfish (which she certainly is a little) this change goes into effect in order to protect her daughter. It's quite lovely actually.

I think the thing I like most is that she stays with it. It seems that once they got to their new home she could be negative (because she clearly wanted something nicer and it took Elinor being the mind of reason to prevent her mother from going a little out of control) about how small it was, but instead she embraced it and thought of positive and how they can make changes later down the road.

All in all, I'm really excited to continue reading out. You know things will change (how sad is it that I can't remember from the movie?) and it's excited to see how things will unfold for these women!

Re: Jane Austen - Sense & Sensibility Chapters 1-10 - Spoilers!

Hi Miri!

So I only got through the first 6 chapters so far. You know, it's always frustrating when you go to do something expecting you'll have lots of time and then it turns out that there's no time at all! Am I glad we're doing 10 chapters a week? Yes, yes I am! : )

Hey, no problem! still lots of week left to finish the other 4 chapters, no hurry! :):)

I really adore the whole developing scene at Norland Park (Chapters 1-5). I think I really like it because of Austen's description of the family members. You can just imagine them and it's so amusing.

She is awesome at characterisation… her people are hilarious.

First we have the brother, as Nicole already stated, lowering his benefits to his mother and sisters and justifying it to himself, as if they don't deserve it at all. It truly is human nature to disguise our less savory traits by stretched excuses, isn't it?

It sure is! :)

You stated, Nicole, that Edward Ferras was a bit on the dull side, and while I agree, so is Elinore, isn't she? She really is a foil for her. I'm glad I know that Elinore really isn't. We get that in her discussion with Marianne regarding her feelings for Mr. Ferras. I love how she's like “We'll he's nice enough and if I knew he liked me a bit more than just friends than I might admit I care for him a bit more than that too.” It just makes me laugh because it's such a typical female avoidance thing. We always want to avoid exposing ourselves to avoid hurt. It's somewhat refreshing to know that our struggles are pretty timeless.

You're right, Elinor is very underemphasised in this part of the book, it's later when she shines out in her glories. And I, too, find it very reassuring that just as women (and men) today like to “play it cool” until we feel a bit more sure that there is interest from the other, this was so hundreds of years ago too…

Marianne and her mother – man they crack me up. Marianne is such a headstrong teenager! She has ideals of passion and art in her brain. What do you want to bet that if she was born in the 90's she'd be off following some sexy musician around, town to town as he tours?

totally! LOL

And for Mama! Well, She is exuberant and a bit exasperating isn't she? I love her though - it's endearing. She is sad she has to leave her home and make a big scene about finding the perfect place to move and then the moment Mrs. John Dashwood is rude and implied Edward and Elinore cannot be she is so offended she must leave at once! She's pretty quick in her emotions, but it's nice to see that instead of being overly selfish (which she certainly is a little) this change goes into effect in order to protect her daughter. It's quite lovely actually.

Right, you want to shake some sense in her sometimes, but you never can get really mad at her, she is so sweet, so totally unconscious…

I think the thing I like most is that she stays with it. It seems that once they got to their new home she could be negative (because she clearly wanted something nicer and it took Elinor being the mind of reason to prevent her mother from going a little out of control) about how small it was, but instead she embraced it and thought of positive and how they can make changes later down the road.

Though of course they could never afford those changes on their tiny income. But that wouldn't worry her - practical details never impinge on her unless forced by Elinor. :)

All in all, I'm really excited to continue reading out. You know things will change (how sad is it that I can't remember from the movie?) and it's excited to see how things will unfold for these women!

Well, we have so many movies and book plots in our heads eh? I have forgotten so many of the plots of books I have read or movies I've seen… I love discovering them all over again :)

Cheers,

Nicole

Re: Jane Austen - Sense & Sensibility Chapters 1-10 - Spoilers!

So I finished reading the rest through chapter 10! Here are my thoughts! : )


Now as for your comments about these later chapters – omg… Marianne is hilarious isn't she? 35 is one foot in the grave! Obviously there's an age thing. Anyone over 30 when you're a teenager is ancient, but I wonder if there's also a question about life expectancy. I mean, people weren't living as long as we are now. Even 17 year olds now are attracted to people in their mid-30's! They look like they are in their 20s! So I suppose times do change, don't they?

I love how Marianne seems to find a perfect mate in Willoughby but I especially adore how Elinore quietly points out that he seems to get enjoyment through making fun of others. I can't remember the exact quote now, and I don't have it on me currently (darn work!) but she said something about how he will make jokes at the expense of others or say things, regardless of how they may feel on it. Of course, Marianne could care less as she is a bit similar, perhaps a bit more polite, but is guided by her passion!

Still I can't help but feel a bit badly for Colonel Brandon! At first there is merely teasing regarding his feelings for Marianne but then it is observed by Elinore that perhaps he has feelings after all. Marianne is vivacious and attractive! Of course he'd be interested in her. What I don't understand is why there is no one moving on Elinore! She's fantastic! I suppose she just doesn't draw attention to herself like Marianne does, hmm?

Re: Jane Austen - Sense & Sensibility Chapters 1-10 - Spoilers!

Now as for your comments about these later chapters – omg… Marianne is hilarious isn't she? 35 is one foot in the grave! Obviously there's an age thing. Anyone over 30 when you're a teenager is ancient, but I wonder if there's also a question about life expectancy. I mean, people weren't living as long as we are now. Even 17 year olds now are attracted to people in their mid-30's! They look like they are in their 20s! So I suppose times do change, don't they?

Indeed, this is a very different world. Your point about life expectancy is a good one.

I love how Marianne seems to find a perfect mate in Willoughby but I especially adore how Elinore quietly points out that he seems to get enjoyment through making fun of others. I can't remember the exact quote now, and I don't have it on me currently (darn work!) but she said something about how he will make jokes at the expense of others or say things, regardless of how they may feel on it. Of course, Marianne could care less as she is a bit similar, perhaps a bit more polite, but is guided by her passion!

She is, they are two peas in a pod in many ways which of course is much of the attraction, a kind of self-love :)

Still I can't help but feel a bit badly for Colonel Brandon! At first there is merely teasing regarding his feelings for Marianne but then it is observed by Elinore that perhaps he has feelings after all. Marianne is vivacious and attractive! Of course he'd be interested in her. What I don't understand is why there is no one moving on Elinore! She's fantastic! I suppose she just doesn't draw attention to herself like Marianne does, hmm?

I think it also has to do with the fact that she doesn't put herself out there. Though she doesn't yet realise it, she is not really available, and probably others sense it.

Cheers,

Nicole

Re: Jane Austen - Sense & Sensibility Chapter One

Hello, yes I love Jane Austen.  I have read Pride and Prejudice 3 times, Emma, and Sense and Sensibility.  I have the others but have yet to read them.  I have them on DVD as well and watch them often.  I not only like her style of writing but also the wonderful stories she dreams up.  I have always been fascinated by England and long to visit.  I can talk about these books for hours.  My favorite by far though is Pride and Prejudice; I love Mr. Darcy and Elizabeth.  My 5 year old daughter loves to watch the Kiera Knightly version of Pride and Prejudice.  We like to pretend we are in the story and live in England and have that lovely accent.

Re: Jane Austen - Sense & Sensibility Chapter One

Yes, I can relate! I love P and P so much, I feel like I know chunks by heart… My daughter and I just got back from a visit to England and now she wants to move there :)

Want to join our Sense and Sensibility discussion? We are talking about Chapter One.

Love,

Nicole

Re: Jane Austen - Sense & Sensibility Chapter One

Wonderful! Thanks Sasha for being ready to join. Feel free to jump into this thread with any comments or quesions on Chapter One of S and S.

Thanks a million for fixing thread title, Samme, as per Miriamele's very sensible suggestion. I have been enjoying reading the e-book tonight - I'm up to chapter 15 but see there are 50 chapters in all, so you may be right, M, a month might be ambitious to get through the whole discussion :) We'll see how it goes….

Love,

Nicole

Re: Jane Austen - Sense & Sensibility Chapter One

I will try my best to read along. I just get so excited about reading that I tend to have about 3 books out at a time that I am reading and it gets overwhelming after a while.  I try to read between semesters of college.  Right now I am still waiting for the fall semester to start.  Good luck to the rest of you guys. 

Re: Jane Austen - Sense & Sensibility Chapter One

No hurry, Lynn! We're just discussing the first ten chapters this week, so any comments you have in there are welcome!

Love,

Nicole

Re: Jane Austen - Sense & Sensibility Chapter One

Can I just say cute? I love that your 5 year old has an appreciation!! That's fantastic. I am also a huge fan of P&P! The story is great and I think that we can all relate to the feelings of pride and prejudice that we each have. It's a fantastic love story. I'm so happy that others seem to adore Austen as I do.

Re: Jane Austen

Miriamele,

Re: Jane Austen

Ooh I think I'll want to pick your brain regarding Northanger Abby! In “The Jane Austen Book Club” there was a lot of talk about each book, but it seemed the consensus was that Northanger Abby was the least favorite book. I wonder if it's because of the screen writer's preference or because the movie tended to reflect popular opinion. There was a lot of talk of distrust and how dull the main character (I can't remember her name now!) is.

I can't wait till we get to it as I really haven't read many and really, it's a travesty!

Re: Jane Austen

Sasha! That will be wonderful. I am so excited that others seem to be as interested as I am. I think that the books aren't too long, but they can be a bit wieldy. I have a lot of free time so manage to get through books fairly quickly but I know that scheduling can be really difficult. This is why I wanted to propose a month. I think it -should- be a decent amount of time for everyone to get involved. Plus, we can always extend if necessary. Either way, I think it will be great for us all to just have this great place to discuss and enjoy the books.

Re: Jane Austen

te hee…

That movie also inspired me to read Persuasion and Masfield Park. Now I only have Emma left to read.

I must say these two books are remarkable. I especially enjoyed Persuasion b/c it shows the maturing of Austen, a mellowing.  Her heroine is a mix between Elizabeth Bennet and Fanny Price- with more compassion. I also enoyed the 10-years-after-the-romance realism.

Austen creates intellectually and socially stimulating worlds and I find myself needing to get out more now…

Re: Jane Austen

Heidi, feel free to jump in and comment on Chapters 11-20 of Sense and Sensibility!

Peace,

Nicole

Jane Austen, Sense and Sensibility, Chapters 11-20

Alright! I feel like I'm slacking here! I have been out of town! I have a couple more chapters to read and then I'm going to post my thoughts on these chapters. Just wanted to let you all know we're still here!!

 : )

Re: Jane Austen, Sense and Sensibility, Chapters 11-20

A funny note to share…

Part of the reason I'm so behind on this end is because I've been out of town but I also just got an iPhone and I've been so terribly obsessed with figuring it out, downloading apps and just general playing. Well tonight I was checking out the books and on the app store in iTunes there are several Austen books! I downloaded Sense and Sensibility for now. I'm so excited. I can now get away with reading when it's slow at work and no one will be any the wiser. I suppose it's slightly unethical but I can't help it! In addition I was able to nab the entire words of Shakespear on there too!

I'm a happy gal!

Re: Jane Austen, Sense and Sensibility, Chapters 11-20 - spoilers

No problem, understand completely! I was just thinking that I too have been preoccupied, and meant today to post something on Chapters 11-20.

So, here goes - I have to go out but will post on Chapter 11

Chapter 11 -

Marianne and Willoughby become more and more entranced with each other, providing everyone with hours of innocent amusement watching them and poking fun at them for being so exclusive :)

This reflects the societal strictures that people who are not engaged are supposed to like everyone equally - no “going steady” then!

Elinor, on the other hand, is really missing Norland. (She does not admit to herself that she is missing Edward.) Her only consolation is cultivating a friendship with Colonel Brandon, though they spend most of their time talking about Marianne :) with whom he is becoming increasingly obsessed. Marianne, it would appear, doesn't believe someone can truly be in love a second time :):)

Again, a relflection of her extreme youth… and wilful disregard of close examples to the contrary (like her own father).

Re: Jane Austen, Sense and Sensibility, Chapters 11-20 - spoilers

I've finished 11-20 and I really loved it! There's a big range of things going on here. We have Marianne and Willoughby entranced with eachother, for one. They're very funny. Nicole, it's so true, isn't it? The whole non-exclusive thing. The problem with them is that they're just so passionate. I actually think they're really cute!

Unfortunate this gaity does change as Willoughby inexplicably leaves! Marianne is in teenage tears and the rest are a bit baffled. Well sort of. It really annoys me that Mrs. Dashwood jumps to the conclusion that he is really hiding his engagement to Marianne. I suppose that their behavior would leave her to believe this. There is certainly a disconnect between my perception and historical perception. They are so entranced with one another – they must be engaged right? Except we, now, would simply call it new, puppy love. Oh well. Anyway, I definitely take Elinor's side in this. She is skeptical and thinks that Willoughby has simply left and basically spurned Marianne.

It's an odd thing there and it's funny, because I should know what the whole reasoning is, but I don't recall.

Anyway, life continues on and one day Edward Ferrars appears for a visit. He stays for about a week. It's interesting that she dwells on the awkwardness that is inherently Mr. Ferrars. In the movie I remember him being awkward, but adorable. It's hard to get that feeling from the book. He just seems… awkward. I am pleased to note that he does warm up and they become more familliar but there really isn't a whole lot of advancement between he and Elinor!

So real quick – there was a question regarding the ring of hair. Marianne notices it and thinks it is her hair, but Elinor sees it as her own. Or did Marianne note that it was Edward's sister's hair? I am so confused. Anyway, it's just a little odd. I mean, I think it does give her a little consoluation but nothing more is said about it. *sighs* So sad. lol I'm too impatient!!

When Edward arrives he also brings in the nosey Middletons. Man oh man, that family is something. How nosey they are! I suppose I can hardly blame them as they live in the country and live lives of leisure. What else are they to do with themselves? After Edward leaves they come by with the Palmers. Now these people are interesting. Mrs. Palmer is definitely her mother's daughter. Gad that woman is obnoxious. Her husband is “droll” and just bored and negative. HOW or WHY did those two get married?? Any insight there?

Hmm I'm rambling too much. I should end this but I do want to note about Elinor's response to Edward leaving vs Marianne's response to Willoughby leaving. Poor Marianne goes into hysterics, basically. She cries all day, at the mention of his name and is a bit morbid by dewlling on what they used to do together. Obviously she is passionate, loves him passionatly and so it makes sense that she behaves this way. Elinor, on the other hand, goes out of her way to behave as if she has no pain at all. She doesn't avoid discussing him, acts normal and just finds things to occupy her time.

I think I just love how mature and serious Elinor is. I almost feel like her love is much more earnest and sweet because she can control herself.

Re: Jane Austen, Sense and Sensibility, Chapters 11-20 - spoilers

The problem with them is that they're just so passionate. I actually think they're really cute!

Aren't they, though! Just adorable :)

Unfortunate this gaity does change as Willoughby inexplicably leaves! Marianne is in teenage tears and the rest are a bit baffled. Well sort of. It really annoys me that Mrs. Dashwood jumps to the conclusion that he is really hiding his engagement to Marianne. I suppose that their behavior would leave her to believe this. There is certainly a disconnect between my perception and historical perception. They are so entranced with one another – they must be engaged right? Except we, now, would simply call it new, puppy love.

As I said, we have a looooot more flexibility now societally. Back then, there was only one possible interpretation - exclusive affection, tears, disappearance - must be a secret engagement! LOL Also, As Elinor sensibly reflects, Willoughby probably doesn't have the means to marry.

You forgot to mention something that is shown in the Austen way to be important but not clear why right now - Colonel Brandon leaving without explaining why he must go - and Mrs Jenning's gossip about him having an illegitimate daughter.

Anyway, life continues on and one day Edward Ferrars appears for a visit. He stays for about a week. It's interesting that she dwells on the awkwardness that is inherently Mr. Ferrars. In the movie I remember him being awkward, but adorable. It's hard to get that feeling from the book. He just seems… awkward. I am pleased to note that he does warm up and they become more familliar but there really isn't a whole lot of advancement between he and Elinor!

No, we have to be so so patient - one of the reasons it's hard for moderns to read these kinds of books :) We are used to things moving so much faster! And more than just awkward he comes across as downright cold and reserved, of course to Marianne but even to Elinor who is even “vexed” with him though of course she doesn't show it and is so proper and hospitable. The coldness and reserve only melted with the full sun-like warmth of Mrs Dashwood when he came to the house which no one could resist :)

Yet he was totally shocked to hear he was reserved! Though it was so obvious to everyone else…

What I find so funny - and so typical of Marianne - is that at first when they see Edward from far off she is convinced it is WIlloughby and nothing can dissuade her from rushing to meet him :)

So real quick – there was a question regarding the ring of hair. Marianne notices it and thinks it is her hair, but Elinor sees it as her own. Or did Marianne note that it was Edward's sister's hair? I am so confused. Anyway, it's just a little odd. I mean, I think it does give her a little consoluation but nothing more is said about it. *sighs* So sad. lol I'm too impatient!!

That's ok, I share that fault or quality :)

About the ring of hair, Marianne thinks it's Edward's sister's hair, and Elinor is convinced that it is her own, Elinor's and worse, obtained sneakily. Again being sensible she doesn't let herself get all emotional about it but decides to try to check it out on her own.

Edward arrives he also brings in the nosey Middletons. Man oh man, that family is something. How nosey they are! I suppose I can hardly blame them as they live in the country and live lives of leisure. What else are they to do with themselves?

Exactly!

After Edward leaves

After far to short a visit, very disappointing and puzzling for poor Elinor!

they come by with the Palmers. Now these people are interesting. Mrs. Palmer is definitely her mother's daughter. Gad that woman is obnoxious. Her husband is “droll” and just bored and negative. HOW or WHY did those two get married?? Any insight there?

Well, Elinor's best guess is probably the right one - he was entranced by her beauty and failed to notice that she was a dimwit :) the triumph of hormones over good sense, probably happened quite often then as now as this kind of couple appears frequently in Austen novels.

Hmm I'm rambling too much. I should end this but I do want to note about Elinor's response to Edward leaving vs Marianne's response to Willoughby leaving. Poor Marianne goes into hysterics, basically. She cries all day, at the mention of his name and is a bit morbid by dewlling on what they used to do together. Obviously she is passionate, loves him passionatly and so it makes sense that she behaves this way. Elinor, on the other hand, goes out of her way to behave as if she has no pain at all. She doesn't avoid discussing him, acts normal and just finds things to occupy her time.

Yet at the same time she spends all the time she can thinking about him and trying to understand why he acted in the way he did.

I think I just love how mature and serious Elinor is. I almost feel like her love is much more earnest and sweet because she can control herself.

Very much so. Austen continues to hammer her point home about the difference between Sense and Sensibility.

Cheers,

Nicole

Re: Jane Austen, Sense and Sensibility, Chapters 11-20 - spoilers

About the ring of hair, Marianne thinks it's Edward's sister's hair, and Elinor is convinced that it is her own, Elinor's and worse, obtained sneakily. Again being sensible she doesn't let herself get all emotional about it but decides to try to check it out on her own.

Ooohkay. I get it now. lol I don't know how I could have missed that exactly but it makes much more sense.

Well, Elinor's best guess is probably the right one - he was entranced by her beauty and failed to notice that she was a dimwit :) the triumph of hormones over good sense, probably happened quite often then as now as this kind of couple appears frequently in Austen novels.

Again, another one I missed. I'ms ure Elinor is completely correct on that matter. I suppose my problem, as I was reading, was that while I imagined her tolerably attractive, I didn't imagine her as a great beauty because she is so annoying! I suppose it's a perfect example on how personality can so easily outweigh looks. I suppose it does happen pretty frequently, doesn't it? Another aspect of human nature that doesn't seem to fade with time. lol

What I find so funny - and so typical of Marianne - is that at first when they see Edward from far off she is convinced it is WIlloughby and nothing can dissuade her from rushing to meet him :)

This makes me think about something I was considering as I was reading. Marianne is very affectionate toward Edward because she wants her sister and Edward to be together. For some reason it makes me surprised that Edward doesn't assume that Marianne may have affection toward him. I mean, as he gets to know her he would deduce the facts that she is just “that way”, but … I don't know. If it were transported to the here and now, I could see a funny series of events where Edward thinks that Marianne is interested in him, but he really likes Elinor and he is even more awkward and then hilarity would ensue.

Or not. lol

Re: Jane Austen, Sense and Sensibility, Chapters 11-20 - spoilers

Ooohkay. I get it now. lol I don't know how I could have missed that exactly but it makes much more sense.

Well, it's going to become more important in the next section, when we find out whose hair is really in the ring :)

Again, another one I missed. I'ms ure Elinor is completely correct on that matter. I suppose my problem, as I was reading, was that while I imagined her tolerably attractive, I didn't imagine her as a great beauty because she is so annoying! I suppose it's a perfect example on how personality can so easily outweigh looks. I suppose it does happen pretty frequently, doesn't it? Another aspect of human nature that doesn't seem to fade with time. lol

That is so true. The other thing, of course, is that Austen tends to be very economic about physical descriptions, and we are used to much more in-your-face descriptions of how hot someone is in modern books… :)

This makes me think about something I was considering as I was reading. Marianne is very affectionate toward Edward because she wants her sister and Edward to be together. For some reason it makes me surprised that Edward doesn't assume that Marianne may have affection toward him. I mean, as he gets to know her he would deduce the facts that she is just “that way”, but … I don't know. If it were transported to the here and now, I could see a funny series of events where Edward thinks that Marianne is interested in him, but he really likes Elinor and he is even more awkward and then hilarity would ensue.

Or not. lol

This is a common feature of Austen novels - I'm guessing it had to do with the rigid societal mores - if someone was sweet on someone else you care about, it would be so very not done to be the slightest bit interested, right? So no confusion possible :) Now we know human nature is not so cut-and-dried, but the social lines were so heavily drawn then, weren't they? Today everything is so fluid, too fluid for the comfort of some at times…

Should we sail into 21-30, it is another week after all?

Cheers,

Nicole

Re: Jane Austen, Sense and Sensibility, Chapters 11-20 - spoilers

Oh yes, we absolutely should! : ) I'm almost finished so I'll be posting that soon!

Is anyone else reading or is it just you and I, Nicole?

Re: Jane Austen, Sense and Sensibility, Chapters 11-20 - spoilers

Good, good, I'll let you post, then and respond, that's fun for me :)

Not sure if there is anyone else reading, if so he or she is being very quiet about it.

Helllloooooooo! anyone else want to join?

Love and light,

Nicole

Re: Jane Austen

Ah, I just found this and would like to join your discussion…but since I'm so behind on this one, I think I'll start with Pride & Prejudice…I'll keep an eye on it to see when you get there :)

Re: Jane Austen

Great Hannah! Pride and Prejudice - I can discuss that anytime, it's such fun - any other takers?

Hugs,

Nicole