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Re: The Hot Politics of Global Warming

Thea said Apr 28, 2008, 8:56 AM:

Zet, you are very right about being more of a social activist. Thank you for the reminder to be inclusive of my government, I need to be reminded at times to be more integrated.   There is a big disconnect in this country between the government and its citizenry.

I think the larger point I was trying to make (until I got into a flaming rant on how people don't care anymore) is that we cannot ONLY rely on government to fix all of our problems because we are the government. We made it, we control it, we give it life. There was a time, two centuries ago, when patriotism was a given, and thinking independently is what gave us this great country in the first place. One of the main tenets of being American is the ideal of independence. What happened to those ideals? You are correct, people are NOT enlightened, do not think independently, and for the most part I put the responsibility of that squarely on the shoulders of the people who have CHOSEN not to be enlightened and not to think independently because they're too busy wasting their time on more frivolous pursuits.

There is a plethora of information out there. Westerners live in a state of ignorance by choice, not by lack of media. I chose for many years to fill my mind with, for lack of a better term, junk t.v., junk food and junk thinking. I've found a few like minded people to talk to about it, but for the most part, people like their stuff and they don't want to change.  With all of the problems in the world, I can't understand WHY.

In answer to your question, yes, I think people do run this country. I thought it strange to see it in another way, although I tried. I don't acknowledge coca cola as a person, I don't see why I should acknowledge a government body as a person. The sole purpose of a government is to safeguard it's citizenry.   The politicians are people elected to office, no different from you or I. But you are right, I should take into consideration the fact that I am not inclusive of the government in my overall plan of changing the world because I lost my belief in the people who run the government. I should revise my thinking a bit to accomodate for the possibility for change, and I thank you for your enlightened comments.

I know the people can make changes in their world with simple things. For example, the commercial interests are starting to change their habits. Take Walmart - their recent campaign to green their stores is not some benevolant gesture and not because of government mandates, but because a section of their demographic in sales is demanding the change with their purchasing power. I know that people have more power than they utilize. But the America I see is apathetic to change and too comfortable in opulance.

For the most part, when I speak to someone about the problems facing the world, most of what I hear back are complaints about prices being too high to sustain their opulant habits or putting off the discussion for more interesting things like Tiger Woods and Britney Spears. It disheartens me, to be honest. I'm very happy to be talking to people like you though. At least my head won't explode.

As for how taxes are spent…. You know most people in this country do not even know how things are slid past in bills or that their representatives are receiving money from outside interests. Call me crazy, but it is my opinion that if our forefathers bothered to declare our independence in the first place, we, as citizens, should be carrying out the same strength and integrity by acting with some intelligence and being part of the change. I do not accept the premise that people are not enlightened and therefore should not be held to the same yardstick as I am. They should be making it their business to be as well informed, if not better. We don't have time for another sit-com , and frankly I'm all out of patience for it. I also do not accept the premise that our goverment constrains our choices. We constrain our own choices by not being proactive and being over indulgent.

I think that in many cases, we agree on the change that needs to be made and the way it needs to be made. My only disagreement is the lack of responsibility put at the average person's doorstep. We only have one planet, after all. If we, as individuals, are not 'englightened' enough to do it ourselves, we must acknowledge the simple truth that we have no one to blame BUT ourselves. 'They' are just following our lead.

namaste, and thank you SO MUCH, for your comments. They were very helpful to me. I will be more diligent in not excluding the government as an entity in the future, thank you for the reminder!

Namaste
Thea

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Re: The Hot Politics of Global Warming

Zet White said Apr 28, 2008, 3:17 PM:

You are quite right, Thea, in reminding me also about our own power. I am nowadays trying to bombard myself with as uncomfortable the truths as possible. I have in front of me George Monbiot's “Heat”, Mark Lynas' “Six Degrees”, Fred Pearce's “The Last Generation” and Ross Gelbspan's “Boiling Point”, amongst other books - the best of “popular science” in the climate change debate and I recommend all those books. Their message is similar: our governments failed. WE are the ones who must act now, to force the governments to force ourselves.

Yes, exactly this: forcing our governments to force us to change is what should be on our schedule. Because, as these authors say, the governments do exactly what we actually want ourselves - to talk about it quite enthusiastically, and then, quietly, do nothing. Like us. We are unconsciously hoping that nothing will be done to decrease our comforts.

The problem is, the main focus of protest in our environmental demonstrations is us. Imagine an unshaved person going to the street with a banner “I must shave!” - and this is similar to what is happening with climate change, in a way. This is what these authors point out, and this is what is making me feel VERY uncomfortable.

I know quite well what wealthy people do. They have several jeeps and SUVs, several homes in different countries, possibly yachts or planes even, and they fly abroad often. The problem is, Thea, I am sitting here wondering if this can be changed. What am I going to tell to all those people I know? To sell their cars, their houses, to stop travelling? To stop enjoying the comfort they actually worked really hard to get to, and feel, perhaps rightly so, that they deserve? Or perhaps I should inspire them instead to use their wealth to invest into sustainable practices and technologies that would benefit all? I see this as a more realistic possibility. We should all combine our comparatively small “monetary power” into one big pro-environmental “monetary power” that would be strong enough to counter the entrenched ways.

Thus I must also comment another thing you say: ”I think PEOPLE do run this country”. Something makes me propose that no, I think MONEY runs this country (any modern country in my opinion). And Wal-Mart would do anything to appear, even to be, greener, anything to keep that cash flowing in, while small local retailers die off a month since they started. Not because of people, but because of money. Do you really think you have a choice in your democratic vote? I hugely doubt it. Your choice is limited to two parties who represent the same elite. This elite is only “elite” because it is supported by HUGE amounts of cash, oil cash, sweat cash, even blood cash. Did you give at least a dollar to Mrs Cinton's or Mr Obama's pocket? I bet you didn't. But some people, very wealthy people, did.

See what I plead for in my profile? ”Do not give in to bribery! You may be bribed by not only people and not only money…” These words sound like scratched glass to me every time, as I feel with my very aura as every minute someone somewhere closes his eyes, ears and mouth and looks away, because someone (or something) else “bribed” him. It pains me, it makes me frustrated, it makes my teeth clench. But to understand this, I must ask you something, and ask you to reply to this.

Imagine you just got elected the president of USA. You, Thea, the President, whose campaign was 30% sponsored by me, Mr White. So you sit there in the oval office, planning on alleviating the sufferings of African people, stopping the wars, helping the poor… And I, with a long cigar in my mouth and two rather meaty bodyguards, elegantly find myself into your office and lock the door. We are about to have a little chat.

I am about to tell you that I have three videotapes, on which you are doing something unthinkable and which can get you out of office immediately. I also know your weak spots - you daughter's health for example - which I can “influence”. I also have an empty cheque in my pocket with your name on it. All I need from you is three legislations, irrelevant of what you talk about on public TV: to legislate in favour of oil companies, to legislate in favour of “peacekeeping” in Afroiraquistan, and to legislate for adopting a “slightly harmful” anti-depression pill for hospital use, for example. Now, how many zeroes whould you like to see on that cheque? Six? Seven? Eight? Nine? Ten? Your grandchildren will not know where to spend this money, but I can keep going…

Imagine this situation really vividly. Imagine this cheque on your luxurious presidential table. And remember president Kennedy. Somehow, something tells me that in this situation you will quickly realise who, what, really runs the country.

You think I am exaggerating? I just witnessed a battle of two economic giants in Ukraine a few years ago, still going. Russian interests vs Western interests. The poison from Russian interests, that was almost lethal, is still quite apparent on the face of our president, even after a cosmetic surgery.

We, “ordinary people”, can still mount an effective pressure, but we have apparently forgotten two things: how to do it, and how politics really works.

Yours truly,
Zet

Re: The Hot Politics of Global Warming

Thea said Apr 30, 2008, 8:35 AM:

“What am I going to tell the people that I know?”

That was the question that jumped out at me, and I'll tell you what I tell other people - do you need it or do you want it? It's a fair question. Sure, as an American, I have a vast amount of purchasing power, but what good is it if I'm utilizing the worlds resources for just myself? So no matter what kind of money I can throw around, I cannot treat the world like it's mine and only mine. There has to be a method of self restraint in place and that can only come from a good meditation practice and common sense. I concede the point that money is a huge problem, but only in as much as people may feel entitled to using it without consequences.

There is a philosophy that I like to use regarding resources and entitlement. It's fine for you to swing your arm around, until it hits me in the head. You're perfectly free to wave arms till you're hearts contented…. but when I get hit, I'm going to say something to make you stop. And I see people getting hit all of the time. So, yes, I'm a bit aggressive towards those who use more than they need because it's careless and irresponsible and uneducated and I don't care if they don't like me for saying so, because someone on the other side of the globe who's sitting in a pile of dirt with sand fleas and parasites NEEDS me to say SOMETHING.

Don't misunderstand, I dont go around knocking on doors and forcing people to recycle (I've considered it, but it's probably a bad idea). People work very hard for the small or medium or LARGE amount of luxury they obtain and for the most part, I'm fine with that. I'm not going to look at someone with luxury and judge them on the basis that they have what others don't because I don't know what they do with the rest of their wealth. They could be feeding a whole third world country for all I know. They could be supplying thousands of people with jobs, I wouldn't know it.

But on the flip side, most people don't check themselves. This is my point: it is our personal responsibility to act with frugality and check ourselves, whether rich or poor. The bottom line is that people are the problem. The money is a factor, but not the problem. And I say that because we, as humans, came up with the exchange, barter, trade, monetary system. It is a means of exchange, nothing more, nothing less.

So, to answer your question about my imaginary presidency…. Is my self worth, virtue and integrity worth the check with all the zero's? No. It's not. I can live quite a long and productive life, even with an impeachment on my record (which, by the way, would be unlikely given that I have my own little thuggish brigade behind me). But I like the question. You kept me thinking about it for quite some time, actually. It helped me to concretize my principals.

As for the uber rich buying presidents and companies and such…. they are only as strong as their own foundation…. and the poor, hungry and down trodden will only take this for so long.

Great Taoist saying that I read yesterday - “you will be sick until you are sick of being sick”. I'm tired of all this - the politics, the money, the stupidity of it all. I'm sick of being sick. Many people have said the same, but are unwilling to do what is necessary to stop being addicted to their own desires for wealth and status. But it will happen. Change is the only constant.

Namaste
Thea

PS - love the accent. I didn't know you could have an accent in an email, but you seem to be able to pull it off. ; )

Re: The Hot Politics of Global Warming

Zet White said Apr 30, 2008, 4:01 PM:

Thea,thank you for the “do you need it?” question. You gave me something to think about…

Actually, I'll go write it down somewhere. For myself, too. No, really, it is so simple yet so good. Without even thinking about carbon emissions and impact and everything, just to ask myself “do I need it or do I want it?” and answer honestly every time! Yes I already “threw away” a couple of useless “wants” as the qustion entered my consciousness, and my conscience. Hmm… I've actually been asking myself this (unconsciously) every time I shop, so I don't have a whole load of shoes and clothes and stuff I don't need. Yes, good stuff!

Short of knocking on people's doors with a recycle bag, I was more thinking in terms of sticking “Your next car better be a Prius, signed:Polar Bear” notes on large jeeps and suv's. ;)

I'm sick of being sick, too. Hmm… But actually I desire wealth and status. Very much so. I want to be able to storm into a president's office for a chat. But I'm more likely to chew on a carrot instead of a cigar and to ask uncomfortable questions about the state of the hospitals and environmental inaction, amongst other things. Wouldn't you want wealth too in this case? I'll share the carrot, promise.

Re: The Hot Politics of Global Warming

Thea said May 1, 2008, 8:29 AM:

Dude, I cannot believe you put “bloody” in a sentence…. That is so cool! I love the British.

Anyway, I'm so gratified that you got ANYTHING out of what I said, so thank you. You made me think alot too. Mostly of my 20's and being so revved up to strike down injustice. I'm still that way, to some extent. However, things change when your kids are taller than you are. Now, it's all about reaching people for me.

As much as it pains me to say it, I think if I ever met President Bush in person, I'd like the guy. No, seriously, he's a very funny guy and I'd like to drink a beer or two with him and talk about baseball. That said, I don't want him running my country. It helps to make the distinction because then I can stop blaming him as a politician and really look at the issues as problems and not blame him personally. We have differences in opinion, but opinions can be changed and modified. I know mine have changed, but all my changes were voluntary. I've never had someone come to me and 'convert' me. So, to some extent, protests serve to give voice to an issue so that those who didn't know will investigate…. but it's not a panacea. Most of the time, when we protest, we're preaching to the choir. You and I already agree, hence the problem of getting others to agree. It's like republicans watching FOX news. They already agree with what's being said, they just need the next sound bite for tomorrow's discussion.

I've found, in very recent times, that it is easier to bring people about to what they should do by example. For example, I've been talking about global warming and recycling for four years at my office and just recently a co-worker said she wanted to start being greener. Now, she's not giving up Nieman Marcus department stores or her gas guzzling car…. but she will buy organic foods and watch her water consumption. That's huge because being green is contagious. You start with one little thing in your life and it just spreads like wildfire. Because of my encouragement, she's greener than she was yesterday and because of her being greener, I have more impetus to try recycling at the office. I just put out a crate and said “put your crap here. I'll take it home” - voila! we now have a recycling system, due to my forethought. And she will talk to her friends and her pastor and her family and my seed will germinate and be fruitful…. No money down.

Being rich and having status have their upsides - more people listen, more people take you seriously, you have more to barter with… but even with those things, it is easier to teach by example rather than purchase loyalties. Any parent will tell you the same. Cookies never worked on my kids, but they sure picked up on every good (and bad) habit I have.

“If you want to build a ship, don't drum people together to collect wood and don't assign them tasks and work, but rather teach them to long for the sea.“ — Antoine de Saint-Exupery

Namaste…. Thank you for adding me to your friends list. I so look forward to getting to know you!

Thea

PS
I love carrots. And I like the polar bear ad too…. perhaps that would work. No, seriously!