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Re: Masculine and Feminine Elements of the Tantric Path

sass said Jun 4, 2006, 4:37 PM:

hi jay, wh, all…

yes from the perspective of the western philsophical trajectory the “feminine” has been body, form, earth, communal, immanent - and the “masculine” mind, emptiness, agentic transcendence. Historically I believe because women give birth and were considered more strongly rooted and thus limited to the body and thus, earth.

So the reference in the Tantra article that you mention WH is indeed an interesting inversion of this.

My personal thoughts are that while there are energy types which are of these two different characteristics (immanence, transcendence : emptiness, form) the link back to man and woman is fairly arbitrary (particularly at higher levels of development) and naming them with these sexual referents seems in many ways .. past its use by date.

jay - I find it difficult to imagine All as anything but the union of both masculine and feminine. I would love to know more, can you explain furher?

sass

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Re: Masculine and Feminine Elements of the Tantric Path

Jay Andrew Allen [no longer around] said Jun 6, 2006, 10:13 PM:

Hey sass,

I don't regard All as the union or division of anything. It's beyond union and division. It's Emptiness, or The One, or “Suchness” - the pure ground from which all being springs, but which is not any being itself.

Given that, I don't have a problem seeing the Divine Feminine as quite separate from the traditional masculine/feminine polarity - just as Christians have no problem saying God created man in His image, yet not regarding God as a “man” in any human sense of the word. For me, the Divine Feminine has a distinctive…”flavor” to it that is neither literal-masculine or literal-feminine, neither masculine-energy nor feminine-energy. It's something of the creative power of the female body, but well beyond that - total in its knowledge, immense in its proportions, unfathomable in its depth, endless in its compassion and nurturing.

Hope that helps. Thanks for the questions; I'm still teasing out much of this for myself.

With Love and Laughter,

-J-

Re: Masculine and Feminine Elements of the Tantric Path

sass said Jun 7, 2006, 12:42 AM:

hi jay

thanks for your answer, its very interesting stuff.

I guess it really becomes semantic at some point because I utterly agree with your description but i just wouldn't name it the Divine feminine. To me its beyond masculine and feminine, it (immanently) includes and transcends both and is just the Divine.

and yes, this is all about questioning and teasing things out and play.. from where I stand too. thanks for playing.

sass

Re: Masculine and Feminine Elements of the Tantric Path

Jay Andrew Allen [no longer around] said Jun 7, 2006, 3:22 PM:

Sass,

I'm opening up to that truth. :) It's the truth Campbell incarnated when he referred to all of these religious forms as “the masks of God”.

Re: Masculine and Feminine Elements of the Tantric Path

sass said Jun 7, 2006, 10:54 PM:

absolutely, Jay!

It's funny though, the devil's advocate in me would also argue about the importance of which mask we give to God.. particularly for me, there is an importance that there is a female mask for God, so that women see the divine mirrored in and as themselves .. a mask which finally dissolves into All, emptiness.