Gilead - Part II

Hello Gilead readers!

This thread is kicking off the next section of reading and inspired dialog. I forgot my book this morning, so I'll have to throw out a generalization for now. Let's continue reading with the same number of pages we read in the first part (to page 43 in U.S. hardcover edition) and include enough additional pages after that to get us to a reasonable stopping point. As soon as I get my copy, I'll post a more specific place in the story; however, anyone can beat me to it if further along already.

What perspectives are unfolding in the book at this point?

For reference:
Book Club intro
Gilead - Part I

Re: Gilead - Part II

Thanks Colin,

I will proceed in the book. When is the next part due for discussion?

Frans

Re: Gilead - Part II

Hi Frans,

Well, I was thinking this week. Poor planning on my part, perhaps?! I should have “assigned” the next section the middle of last week; I'm juggling several objects in my life and I missed that. It's not very demanding reading (compared to the philosophy and psychology books that I often read!) and 40+ pages is theoretically manageable for reading this week and posting comments as we go.

Sound likely?

Re: Gilead - Part II

I just don’t want to put ideas in people’s heads before they’ve come to that part and can interpret things for themselves first - or have that done to me; that’s the best part about reading I think!

How about starting the discussion on Thursday? I just picked that day because it’s good for me - I’m fine with Friday, Saturday or Sunday too.

Frans

Re: Gilead - Part II

Bless you both. Taking it slow this week is good for me. Arthur may get his hands on the book today…yes, Colin?

In a week, God willing, my life will be slightly less chaotic and I'll be back in the swing of things.

Liz

Re: Gilead - Part II

Starting the discussion on Thursday works for me. That'll give me some time to read, ponder and formulate responses.

Re: Gilead - Part II

Okay Gileaders,

WOW, what a book - the prose is thick and beautiful and the ideas that MR weaves in the plot are quite something.

To me the very first few minutes of listening to the second part (I have the cd’s) were like - WOW. I actually listened to that first part 3 times - when he clearly identifies himself as the witness, taking a non-personal stand on his parishoners confessions, and how much he enjoys doing that. Then he goes on to say that there are at least 3 participants to every thought: the self, the Self and Self (the Lord) - that is beautiful!

I’m only going to mention 1 more part that took my breath away, then hope you all will get in there too: This is when he relates to dying soon and being reunited with wife and child - the love he feels for his second wife and child lives alongside the love he has for Louisa and Rebecca - that brought tears to my eyes…

Frans

Re: Gilead - Part II

Frans, you're all alone in here! My apologies for my late arrival; I have been at a conference for work, with no computer access. I plan to read more on my lunch hour today and add some comments.

Those two parts you brought into light caught my attention, too. I watched an internal post-Amber voice balk at his thoughts about meeting his first wife and child again. And an integral vibe sparked at his 1-2-3 witnessing awareness. Good stuff!

Everyone else…let's keep this party going!

Re: Gilead - Part II

I just picked up the book again, and the first words I read really resonate with my own personal history:

Now that I look back, it seems to me that in all that deep darkness a miracle was preparing. So I am right to remember it as a blessed time, and myself as waiting in confidence, even if I had no idea what I was waiting for.

Here he's referring to the long period between wives. For me, it reincarnated thoughts of all of the really dark times in my life, including times when I wasn't even really conscious of how dark it was. I remember distinctly that feeling of waiting with confidence or hope that the potential for better days and more freedom and communion was worth all of the pain and aloneness. I had a very clear sense of this too shall pass. My focus then, of course, was on it passing. Now I have a different perspective: those dark times were crucial for the emergence of the person I express today.

Re: Gilead - Part II

This part reminded me of some of the surface tension that has been arising in this pod:

…in my present situation, now that I am about to leave this world, I realize there is nothing more astonishing than a human face. Boughton and I have talked about that, too. It has something to do with incarnation. You feel your obligation to a child when you have seen it and held it. Any human face has a claim on you, because you can't help but understand the singularlity of it, the courage and loneliness of it. But this is truest of the face of an infant. I consider that to be one kind of vision, as mystical as any. Boughton agrees. (emphasis mine)

It seems that we, as humans, long for communion, yet we so often act in ways that reinforce loneliness. It is the recognition of this inherent separation and loneliness (and the related suffering) that really opens my heart to others. We are alone together.

Re: Gilead - Part II

Hello Colin, Frans,

I was just today able to get to the next section of the book.  Colin, I am honored at your sharing and connecting with your observations and personal connections to the novel. 

I am finding myself in observation mode and resonating most with his observations (of course they are all observations) but more specifically, I read this sentence over and over….

This morning the world by moonlight seemed to be an immemorial acquaintance I had always meant to befriend.

I am watching myself enjoy his role as the observer.  It seems to be a very telling connection for me at the moment as I am just coming out of what seems to have been a long sleep of mostly observing. 

I also enjoyed the passage about the fireflys but can't find it at the moment.

In observation,

Gina

Re: Gilead - Part II

Gina,

Yes, there are so many little gems, like the fireflies, the line of oak trees that still can make him wonder, the black man’s sense of humour, the big black horse, the relationship difficulties she eludes to in Boughton’s household etc.

MR weaves all these observations into a very compelling story. I am enjoying it a lot.

For the other readers out there, if we’re moving too fast - only 3 have contributed to the 2nd part so far I can slow down - no rush - but do let us know!

Frans

Re: Gilead - Part II

Yes, Gina, I enjoyed the part about the fireflies, too. And sitting as the observer witnessing life through his eyes brings on a relaxed awe in me.

Frans, I am with you on your call out for more of us to join in this conversation. Where'd everyone go? Let's let this section fly for this next week and see if we get any latecomers. I propose that we read just up to this quote, on p. 101 in my edition:

“I came home from lunch today and found you playing catch in the street with Jack Boughton.”

Re: Gilead - Part II

Hey book-clubbers!

I'm nearly upto the end of our second section.

I've been really struggling with this book - not feeling it at all.  Then I read a good chunk on the train yesterday and really into it a lot more.  I think part of my problem is that I've been reading on my lunch break from work, and have struggled to really immerse myself in the subtle, slow humanity of the story while my mind is still rather pre-occupied. 

I've also just read Timeline by Michael Crichton immediately before this book, and I kept waiting for something to actually *happen* haha.

Colin, I clocked the passage about the importance of the human face too - very apt!

I think one of the interesting aspects of the book is that its all retrospective, and all from John's perspective (or it is so far anyway) - you don't get any interaction.  I think thats one of the reasons I've been a bit resistant - I've realised that I rely on watching people (even fictional people) in relationship to really get to know them.  Even if that someone is in relationship with me, its watching the interaction that I find most intersting.  You don't get of that in the book.

Reading in a more appropriate environment (LR) really helped me loosten some of my resistance though and just immerse myself in his words.

Where do you guys read (LR)? 


Ewan

Re: Gilead - Part II

Hey Ewan!

I am reading Gilead mostly on my lunch breaks at work, sitting in my tiny office with a wall of trees behind me through large windows. The slow-paced unfolding of his story lends itself to reading it in small chunks. I am really enjoying this deliciously slow walk in the world of fiction. It's a nice break from all of the more intellectual non-fiction that fills my shelves at home.

I'm glad you're sticking with it!

Re: Gilead - Part II

Colin - sounds like a plan to me.

Ewan - I “read” in the car (this book), at home, when I’m at Communitea having a coffee - anywhere! Books are good friends of mine.

I would have had a hard time getting into this book too if I had been in a more restless place in my life (meaning pretty much all of my life up until a few years ago). Maybe the book tapes are acually helpful here; the narrator has a deep, resonating voice which is easy to listen to.

Frans

Re: Gilead - Part II

I've been away for so long, it was fun to read all of these responses to the book. I'm sorry I don't have time to reply to each one of them. I haven't been able to reread the book at all, as I've been embroiled in my own drama. But y'all will be happy to know that my copy has done a bit of travelling: first to Vancouver in my car (almost all of I-5), then to the Canadian/American border, then back to Vancouver, then back to the border, then back to Vancouver, then back to the border and finally, through the border, to Portland Oregon. Tomorrow, it will wend its way back to Sacramento, where I hope to catch up with you and actually post something of value here.

I'm so thrilled to have all of you in this cyberworld we-space. I've been looking at my copy and feeling everyone's presence even though I couldn't participate.

Liz

Re: Gilead - Part II

Hey y'all

I want to tell you that so far in my reading this is a magnificent book -feels to me like its written by a human being who is touching sacred depth.  Thank you Liz and Lauren for choosing this one. 

What I am finding for myself as i pick up this book, is that I do so much headwork at work, that after work my face and body turn away from reading. (And turns away from other things like watching TV after all those computer screens) in order to get a better balance.  I noticed when I went for a weekend of Reiki that after that I did feel like reading so again- balance.  So i need to honour this process of balancing and that means to me I cant at present take part in this lovely bookclub as i had hoped. 

Still reading your responses is wonderful. (and reading on zaadz isnt like reading a book for me - not to the same extent - because I feel the presence of all of you behind the words and that changes it).

Carry on dancing, love Gitanjali

Re: Gilead - Part II

Well, it seems the energy around this book and thread is about as slow and relaxed as the book itself! Thanks to everyone that has been able to participate.

To keep things moving, I propose that we start reading more and pick up the related discussion or posting of insights and resonances on Monday (7/9). It seems as though the following quote is a good stopping point for the next section:
”And often enough, when we think we are protecting ourselves, we are struggling against our rescuer. I know this, I have seen the truth of it with my own eyes, though I have not myself always managed to live by it, the Good Lord knows. I truly doubt I would know how to live by it for even a day, or an hour. That is a remarkable thing to consider.” (p.154 in my edition)

That is followed by a line at the top of the next page and: ”I believe it will put my mind at ease to tell you straightforwardly what is at issue here.”

Re: Gilead - Part II

Page 176 in UK paperback edition.

Juliee

Re: Gilead - Part II

Thanks for the quote Colin, that’ll help me find the spot on the cd’s. The thread-pace is quite slow, isn’t it? Maybe the next book (Pelle) should be an action thriller psychodrama filled with lust, murder and intrigue…

Frans

Re: Gilead - Part II

Sorry I'm late!!

I felt the need to go back and start at the beginning.

The section I marked and read over several times was:

By 'life' I mean something like 'energy' (as the scientists use the word) or 'vitality' and also something very different. When people come to speak to me, whatever they say, I am struck by a kind of incandescence in them, the 'I' whose predicate can be 'love' or 'fear'  or 'want' and whose object can be 'someone' or 'nothing' and it won't really matter, because the loveliness is just in that presence, shaped around 'I' like a flame on a wick, emanating itself in grief and guilt and joy and whatever else…To see this aspect of life is a privilege of the ministry which is seldom mentioned.

It reminded me of the incandescence I 'feel' rather than 'see' in reiki.

It also got me to wondering why do people join 'the ministry'? I never really thought before about the benefits of 'the ministry' being discussed and 'sold' to would-be ministers. I assumed there was either a deep calling or (from my catholic upbringing experience) familial pressures and expectations. (I know, a very narrow outlook, but as I say, I never really thought about it before).

Juliee

Re: Gilead - Part II

Hi julie,

The further in the book you get, the more examples you’ll see of John’s insight into reality; he is a very spiritual being, almost in spite of his vocation (that comes through in little bits and pieces). I think that is one of the main underlying themes of the book: the fact that his humanity, insight and spirituality stand out no matter what. He could have been a shoe salesman and still would have been the same essential being.

Frans

Re: Gilead - Part II

Hi Frans

You're right, I'm almost at the point of contributing for Part III and there are so many examples of John's spiritual being-ness I've highlighted that I'll struggle to cut it down to one or two for this thread.

Having said that as I'm reading these sections I have to say I'm seeing Marilynne Robinson in my mind's eye not John Ames. It's quite a strange feeling having the author slip into my mind rather than the character.
I've never done that with JK Rowling (just over one week and counting to THAT book)!!

Juliee

Re: Gilead - Part II

Maybe that speaks to MR’s skills - to be able to portray anybody in the character.

F