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The Integral Pod

The Integral Pod (formerly I-I+Zaadz, or IIZ) is a discussion group (a.k.a. “pod”) for enthusiasts of the work of Ken Wilber and other proponents of integral thought. Our aim here is to provide a “We-space” for broad discussion of second-tier living, loving and learning. Please read our vision and guidelines – the ...(more)
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This is the place to discuss all things integral, at all levels, but with an emphasis on challenging ourselves and each other through the insights that Integral Theory can provide. [AQAL focus: upper-left (UL), individual/interior, inner transformation]
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RLtruthseeker-artist : Integral Mysticism
RLtruthseeker-artist posted a reply to the conversation "Integral theory and Ethics" ()
RLtruthseeker-artist : Integral Mysticism
RLtruthseeker-artist posted a reply to the conversation "Integral theory and Ethics" ()
Tom : oceanslug
Tom posted a reply to the conversation "Integral theory and Ethics" ()
james : human
james posted a reply to the conversation "Integral theory and Ethics" ()
Tely : Truth Seeker
Tely posted a reply to the conversation "Integral theory and Ethics" ()
Tom : oceanslug
Tom posted a reply to the conversation "Integral theory and Ethics" ()
down  Group Grapevine
Grey : Integral Ideator (I-I)
Grey Link! Cool! :D (10 months ago)
Grey : Integral Ideator (I-I)
Grey Just testing URLs in the grapevine. This link will take you to Pelle's blog: http://is.gd/ixdm (I want to see if this gets converted to a link or if you have to copy and paste it.) (10 months ago)
Grey : Integral Ideator (I-I)
Grey Oof! Just saw this now, Siona.... Yeah, flutters I think it was... no, "flaps", but I don't like it much. "Flutter" was the name to replace "Grapevine". Anyway, I just used "tweets" here because it's more readily recognizable. :) (11 months ago)
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  Tely : Truth Seeker

Buddhism and Psychotherapy

Tely said Apr 28, 9:47 PM:

 

This article , ”How A Zen Master Found the Light (Again) on the Analyst's Couch,” was in the New York Times a couple days ago.  It addresses the issue of the belief in the concept of non-self as potentially harmful for someone who never had a healthy sense of self and the reintegration of self through the investigation of emotions.  I thought it was a nice example of a (piece of an) ILP – integrating practices.

  james : human

Re: Buddhism and Psychotherapy

james said Apr 29, 5:04 AM:

 

Thanks Tely

This is brilliant and deeply moving.

James

  Tom : oceanslug

Re: Buddhism and Psychotherapy

Tom said Apr 29, 9:43 AM:

 

Hi Tely, I asserted on another thread that what most spiritual teachers IMO do is take an experience which caps a long-time process and turn it into a statement of the process which led to that experience.  That just cannot be right, logically, experientially or otherwise!  The so-called no-self experience IMO requires you be a human and not a tree, and as a human that you be in some regard post-Neanderthal, and in being post-N that you have paid attention in certain directions and etc etc, including that you have gone through the so-called self stage.  Why else call it no-self?  Negating needs something to negate.

Thus in confusing the process that leads to so-called no-self with no-self as the result of that process, teachers are putting cart before the horse.  Doing so must retard if not derail certain peoples' natural necessary processes.

  Tom : oceanslug

Re: Buddhism and Psychotherapy

Tom said Apr 29, 2:25 PM:

 

From the article, a Zen teaching circa mid-80s:

“What you need to do, Lou, is put aside all human feelings.”  Say it isn't so.