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Re: The Core Essentials

Damon [no longer around] said Feb 10, 2007, 2:10 AM:

Rob

As usual a thought provoking and intelligent post to what is a difficult subject. I “resurfaced” this post not as a reminder but the FIT PDF covered some of my question of previous posts and gave a different language to what I am trying to understand.

Interesting as a side note to your post that what is perceived as a masculine practice has a feminine deeper context of embrace. I wander for us males that the impact that this practice has for us deeper levels attracts us to this practice more so than a masculine impulse to be strong and dominant.

If I also recall back to the discussion that Shawn had with Ken Wilber there was this reference to strength training having the capacity to embrace and evoke the ever present witness (not with this language). Specifically the discussion focused on the capacity of traditional mediation and yoga practices exploring the deeper valleys of stillness (or ever present witness) but having less capacity to explore peak states. In the fit PDF the scale of attention these practices are dominated in the “receptive” part of the curve and less so in the focus.

My own experience of an intense yoga practice enabled me to access the focused part of the curve however it was very hard work and didn’t come naturally to this practice. What I am finding with the strength training it facilitates this focus/embrace with greater effect but I am yet to fully realise the deeper aspects of the more receptive effects.

So I am finding each practice (meditation and strength training) has their relative benefit of exploring different spectrums of the focus/receptive states. Each has its capacity and strengths of development. Each can be leveraged as a meditation of embrace and a meditation of awareness.

So I guess the game to find a way of exploring both states in both practices and focusing the balance of embrace/awareness where our being needs it most for our body-mind development. Oh it’s that easy :-))…….mmm in fact thinking about it no its not. How does one recognise where one needs a focus on one aspect of the spectrum of awareness. Can/should strength training be used as an exclusive practice without the need from the influence of other practices? Are there limitations to strength training even within the deeper FIT context? What are they? What should a FIT seeker look out for as signs you are off the map.

These are not question I want answers for by you Rob or the Pod I am just putting them out there for future discussion and an expression of where I am at with this part of the FIT philosophy and strength training.

Thankyou for your post, having access to this discussion is a great gift and I greatly value what you bring to this subject.

Strength and spirit (btw the direct translation of balaprana).

Damon

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Re: The Core Essentials

Rob said Feb 18, 2007, 9:20 PM:

Ok, I’m a total sucker for great Q’s so here’s a quick stab at these.

How does one recognise where one needs a focus on one aspect of the spectrum of awareness?

- I think this is one of the central contributions of the AQAL framework- the integral landscape is a great tool for sweeping one’s life and figuring out what’s being left out in some way.

- Although, there’s no way to see it all so to speak - every perspective has its blindspot, which leads to the importance of an integral practice. Regardless of what you see and don’t see, if you’re “training” all of the major aspects of yourself on a regular basis you’re more likely to stuble across and start working on dimensions that might have otherwise have fallen off the map and into blindspots.

Can/should strength training be used as an exclusive practice without the need from the influence of other practices?

- Absolutely! I believe strength training is a discipline full unto itself. With that said though, strength training and the practioner doing the strength training are fundamentally not two. For most people, there’s much to gain from looking at the depth, tradition and lineage within say the yogic, martial arts and contempative/meditative traditions as there’s much to be learned from the thousands of years of practice.

- My bias is that at a certain point these other approaches that can compliment strength training must be “put down” so to speak. Once a certain level of maturity has been achieved a dedictated strength trainer has the responsibility to the discipline and to him/herself to truely give themselves to the practice, give themselves to the weights fully and whole heartedly. That’s my bias though… the field of authentic mastery resides beyond this step.

Are there limitations to strength training even within the deeper FIT context? What are they?

- This is an excellent question, There’s the obvious its not going to turn you into a marathon runner by itself. I don’t think you’re inquiring along these lines though - No its not going to increase the number of mitochondria in your cells… with that said, strength training’s limitation is that it is primarily a zone 1 practice (meaning zones 2 through 8 aren’t the central focus). I’m going AQAL crazy right now - but check out Ken Wilber’s Integral Methodological Pluralism to learn more about this. He’s brilliantly articulate on this front and I think I’ll leave this clarity to him. You can read about it his book Integral Sprituality or on his posts on the shambhala site (and also on the Integral Spiritual Center website).

- I think the limitations brought about by this practice as it pertains within the inside of the UL quadrant (zone one), are largely a result of the practitioner.

- With that said the biggest limitation is there isn’t the LL cultural network of practioners and “teachers” so to speak that can lead people down this UL interior road. The whole field of strength training is caught in the UR quadrant - for the most part the exteriors are honored and recognized (and in most cases worshipped). This is truely a shame. It’s painful feeling this rift within the fast majority of gyms around the US (and I’m guessing around the world - although my strenght training outside of the US is very limited (Switzerland was my last non US training experience and I didn’t see or feel much of a difference on this front). This is a HUGE hurdle, one that I hope to contribute to with my writing and my work with people in their training.

What should a FIT seeker look out for as signs you are off the map.

- Ok, you are off the hook! You’re Q’s are just AMAZING! Love em buddy…

- I’m going to just give an overview of a bundle of stuff - some more on the practical side of the street, others more on the theoretical side of things.

a. Self critical self talk / unwillingness to compare with others (both are a “sticking point”
b. Inability to recover effectively (emotional & mental dimensions)
c. Trying to force themselves into the “zone”
d. Trying too hard
e. No Goals
f. Over Training (big problem when you master the deeply enjoyable dimensions of FIT)
g. Indifference and uncertainty as a general mood.

- Perhaps the biggest obstacle when FIT has really been integrated and “mastered” (please not mastering FIT is not the mastery of Strength Training) is the attachment to enjoyment. This is what I call the “pleasure trap.” It’s a nasty place to get caught because its so hard to get out. This attachment or sticking point as I’ll often call them often cuts you off from the genuine joy of training but the biggest nail in the foot is this attachment stunts the ongoing development within their own evolution of strength training.

- The way out of this is to further focus working on one’s ability to surrender to the process of training and to go after the more uncomfortable or “painful” (pain from a more conventional stand point) dimensions of training. Burrowing down to the core of intention is critical and this is perhaps the one stage that a contemplative practice outside of one’s training is VERY helpful.

Ok, there’s my two cents buddy…
Peace
~Rob

PS: someone else get in on this good stuff!

Re: The Core Essentials

Damon [no longer around] said Feb 28, 2007, 11:43 PM:

Rob

Your answers always seem to raise more questions - sign of a good answer. There are three dimensions associated with this discussion so far that I want to explore further:
• Path towards FIT authentic mastery/maturity
• Self critical self talk within the practice of strength training
• Surrender to the process of training

Rather have a conversation that deals with all of them at once I thought I might deal with them in separate posts starting with “The Path” question first.

Ill start by revisiting the FIT document as it relates for me to the “Path”:

Focus Intensity Training enables you to begin uncovering your larger potential through strength training. By using the FIT techniques outlined here you can shift your conventional training into the deeper, neglected and hidden dimensions of strength training. In the process you will discover a more efficient, effective and enjoyable practice that yields greater energy for your demanding life and higher degrees of mental and emotional control all while developing your very best body and mind. Page 9 FIT PDF

Ok, most of the FIT document relates to the technique of FIT and the peak states and less about the development other than what is written above. There is a lot of great information and technique encompassed in the description within FIT, but for me there is not a lot of information about what a FIT seeker can expect at different stages of a development towards authentic mastery. I don’t have the span or consistency of strength training practice to know what to expect if I commit to this practice.

Building on the AQAL framework, there is probably a line of development in each of the quadrants that reflects different aspects of the FIT philosophy. What I have thought about so far at within this framework for a UL line associated with FIT specifically is the following:

Stage 1: physical: strength (obviously), health, energy, familiarisation with recovery and focus cycles, receptive to basic skills and technique of strength training, self image actualisation.
Stage 2: emotional: improved awareness of self talk, increased sexual desire, improved body image, greater confidence, increased need for connection to others (I am introverted by nature), sensitivity to the body need for rest
Stage 3: mental: improved concentration, receptive to, greater awareness of movement and impact on nervous system, greater reception of new ideas, access to the “zone”, neuromuscular connection to movement, development of a broad receptive view of self
Stage 4: intellectual: greater control of body systems, greater capacity to deal with painful experience, deeper understanding of pathological tendency, movement with the sensitivity of breath and the energetic response
Stage 5: spiritual: detachment from pleasure/painful experience, deeper connection with self, non-dual awareness of the Self, Big Mind, development of extra-ordinary strength capacity and detachment there of…….

This is not an exhaustive list by any means but I am thinking as an experiment of social interaction that this forum could build upon a framework such as AQAL related to FIT/strength training specifically and individual’s experience that relates to these different stages. I have less of an idea of the relevance and framework of the exterior dimensions within this practice and what they may look like.

Back to the maturity question…. At this stage I’m focused on the maturity of the techniques within FIT. As Jeepdog pointed out in a previous post, too much thinking about these techniques leads one vulnerable to dropping the weight on one self (leading to a massive reversal of ones development :-)) . As a development of Stage 1 IM thinking that FIT may not be relevant as a focused technique, important to be aware of - but it may be too much for someone with a limited understanding of basic bodybuilding lifts and programs. I am in two minds here what would be the best progression of a new seeker of both strength training and FIT – develop a FIT understanding first then refine techniques or develop a basic understanding of strength training and incorporate FIT as a process of refinement.

I’m also looking to what strength training practices encompasses FIT. To me strength training is a broad definition of physical practices that could involve the following:
• Body Building techniques
• Olympic Lifts
• Strongman training
• Body Weight exercises including Pilates, Yoga, Gymnastics
• High Intensity Interval Training (HIIT)
• Martial Arts training

Correct me if im wrong Rob, but the different perspective that FIT brings to this discussion is the rhythm of the FIT cycle and specific intention to expanding awareness through a strength training practice. I agree with your previous post - I can’t focus and master all the potential different physical techniques and practices above and in attempting to do so may limit my capacity to greater and deeper development. I guess related to a statement in your previous post – I don’t know what to put down yet as they are all important to me an integral part of my strength training experience. The reason may be at the moment I see a number of important aspects of strength training within three of the above list at this stage of my development. To put down one of these is an attachment I am dealing with.

Strength and Spirit
Damon

Re: The Core Essentials

T [no longer around] said Mar 19, 2007, 3:22 AM:

I think the greatest benefit of dedicated body work is that is gives your body the avenue to work as its designed….to move! If anyone has sat at a desk all day, you know you need to move to feel better - both physically and mentally.

The hardest part is motivating yourself to move when you are mentally exhausted.

peace…
T

Re: The Core Essentials

Rob said May 10, 2007, 10:38 AM:

Hey Damon,
As usual - sorry for the delay - here's some of my thoughts with regards to your post:
There is not a lot of information about what a FIT seeker can expect at different stages of a development towards authentic mastery. There's some generalizations that can certainly be pulled out; however, the path to mastery is fundamentally an individual journey. We've all got our own sticking points, our own gifts, our unique approaches and views, etc.

An important side point is I don't believe FIT is itself a path to Mastery. It's a stepping stone beyond the conventional approaches to strength training; however, it does not retain the instruction as to how to enact Mastery, at least not in my opinion. FIT is a start, an important critical start.

Back to a thread you touched on:

Ultimately no one knows what they're committing to nor what they're to expect. Yes there is preparation, education and experimentation; however, there's forever an unknown quality that is fundamental to the path. That's my bias of course but I think it's an important element to full forward into the light. There's uncertainty right now in this moment, there's an unknown quality to every now and this is where you will find life emerging moment to moment and to which you must be willing to die to moment to moment.

This process of becoming more alive through dying to the now in all its known and unknown aspects, its evolving and timeless elements - is none other than the path to mastery - at least as to how I hold and understand mastery.

What's along the way? Everything in some sense.

As for the generalizations, I've developed a developmental strata I baked from the defining features of about a dozen or so developmental theories. I then pulled these and distilled them down into a handful of stages as they pertain to development.
Here's the progression:

- avoiding
- building
- achieving
- growing
- thriving
- mastery

I'll post an excerpt from the book I working on for you to read that provides a quick overview of these stages in a new post as it's pretty long and I'd like to stay on track here. I'll provide a link at the end of this post.

As for beginning strength trainers, your right FIT is a little over their heads so to speak. First you need to develop the basics, then you can begin to focus on the refinements of the more subtle dimensions of training. Focus on consciously contracting the muscle as prescribed in FIT's Focus phase before you've grown your nervous system to even be able to create a full contraction and we'll you're ahead of yourself and well you probably will drop the weight on yourself.

I'm not sure there's a “best” way for someone to learn with FIT; however, I find that after an adequate level of mastery up through the achieving stage it's helpful to back off from the conventional world view and to deepen the engagement with themselves while strength training. This isn't to say that people working on the 'building phase' can't benefit from FIT. It's just that their capacity to integrate and enact the deeper dimensions of strength training has yet to fruition. Providing them with the view and the understanding that it's there to be grown into is indeed an advantage for the mind that's receptive.

Ok, I'm rambling here, but let's pick up these threads as there's rich material here.

The Path To Mastery