Judaism/Islam/Catholicism/Buddhism - which is the most tolerant?

http://www.allvoices.com/contributed-news/3692716-division-in-the-ranks-acceptance-of-gay-bishops-by-the-episcopal-church/image/35696449
The graphic is self-explanatory. But there sure must be room for discussion! Have your say!!

Re: Judaism/Islam/Catholicism/Buddhism - which is the most tolera

Indeed, there is much room for discussion and dissension on all points. If you speak to individual Catholics, Jews, Muslims, Buddhist, you will find a wide range of opinions on all these points. 

Culture influences individual opinion deeply, in a way that is hard to grasp, as the proverbial fish not knowing about the water it inhabits.

So, if the message from the media is constantly everything is “blue” (in the above diagram, allowed), religious people will be influenced as well.

Is this a good thing? A bad thing? Some say the former, some say the latter. But it is, and what we do about it is for each of us to decide.

I think it's important for each person to think through why he or she believes this or that on these issues and others. There is much reflexity and blanket generalisation instead of logic and consideration of consequences. 

Love,

Nicole

Re: Judaism/Islam/Catholicism/Buddhism - which is the most tolera

Re: Judaism/Islam/Catholicism/Buddhism - which is the most tolera

Re: Judaism/Islam/Catholicism/Buddhism - which is the most tolera

Good idea, Tharlam, thanks for leading the way.

As an Anglican Christian, who grew up and lives in the Canadian context:

on Teen Sex: I think that in many cases it's not a good idea, for many many reasons but none of them being that I think teens who have sex are going to hell. (I don't think anyone is going to hell.)


on Premarital Sex: I don't see this as problematic per se, though it is probably not healthy in any sense to have sex very casually. I believe sex is something to be taken seriously, to delight in but not to treat like candy. 


The New Testament writings are very firm on sex outside marriage and very culturally appropriate in that sense. We are living in different times.


on Divorce: again, not a bad thing in itself, but perhaps taken too lightly and done too readily by many without attempting to work through the underlying issues leading to relationship breakdown. I divorced after spending years in counselling and seeking every way I could see for the marriage to work. Marriage is one of the most vital sacraments, something that ideally happens between two people who love each other deeply and are wholeheartedly committed to each other's best interests, whether or not it is accompanied by a formal service. I believe there are true marriages between people who never had any ceremony and relationships that are marriages legally but empty of meaning.


Jesus' statement on divorce in the New Testament is unequivocal and problematic for literalists. I see it as perfectly appropriate given the cultural context, but no longer applicable to our modern society, as other norms of that time that we now disregard (demanding that women have long hair or head coverings, for example).


on Masturbation: this to me is the least problematic of the list. It is surrounded by far too much shaming and finger-pointing. It could be taken to an unhealthy degree like anything but generally is neutral, IMO. There is almost nothing in the Scriptures about this except the case of Onan, which does not have to do with masturbation at all (or contraception as is also erroneously believed by some).


on Abortion: ideally I believe it would be better if there were never abortions, because I believe people are precious at all ages, from conception. But we do not live in an ideal world. I believe women should decide this with the fathers of their children, the child came to be jointly and is not solely the purview of the woman to decide what happens with him or her. I believe women should have open access without blame and shame to abortion.


on Birth Control: it is irresponsible to be pro-life, I think, and to frown on all forms of contraception except hit-and-miss, problematic “natural” birth control. That is just plain unrealistic and completely unsubstantiated from the Scriptures. Consistent contraception is necessary if abortion rates are not going to be even more crazily high than they are. Abstinence is just not going to be the norm for everyone including committed couples and why should it be? Sexual love is a wonderful gift of God.


on Homosexual Orientation: this is the one I find most odd in the list - how can one be against homosexual orientation? It's like my saying, “Gravity is so wrong. Someone should do something about that.” People are who they are, and are loved by God. You can be against people living out their orientation, though again, it seems very strange to me - I wouldn't want anyone saying I could never marry or be in a loving physical relationship with anyone because my desires are inherently wrong and twisted. 


I have studied the Scriptures very carefully on this issue and there is in fact much less support there for homophobia than is commonly believed. One can make an excellent case from the wider context of the Scriptures that gay love is just as valid and sacred as hetero love.


 Are my views typical? I don't know. But I do know that you can find every part of the range of positions within the Anglican communion worldwide on every point, and that culture does play a large role in those opinions.


Love,


Nicole


 

Re: Judaism/Islam/Catholicism/Buddhism - which is the most tolera

Further to your point about Tibetan culture and homosexuality, see here:

A post which Tricycle editor James Shaheen recently wrote at the Huffington Post blog has picked up a good bit of attention around the internet.  James’s subject was the Dalai Lama’s views on gay marriage, which, as he rightly discussed, are quite a complicated matter.  In part this stems from the utterly different cultural and religious assumptions about sexuality that monks raised in traditional Tibetan culture bring to the discussion, vs. the cultural and religious assumptions of Western gay rights advocates (or, for that matter, Western opponents of gay marriage).These differences aren’t just around same-sex relations, but also include differing ideas about what marriage is, why one enters into it, what role (if any) religion plays in defining or sanctioning marriage, and so on. For example, polygamy was common and accepted in traditional Tibet, often taking the form of polyandry–marriage by a woman to two or more men, especially brothers within the same family.  This form of marriage still persists today in Tibetan cultural areas less directly touched by official Chinese policies.  One could argue that the Dalai Lama has as much right to demand that gay rights advocates get over their “polyphobia” and start explicitly agitating for American government legal recognition of polygamy as they have to demand he get rid of his “homophobia.” …

Re: Judaism/Islam/Catholicism/Buddhism - which is the most tolera

Oh, I want to joing the experiment!

Practicing Roman Catholic (notice all the red on the chart?)

Teen Sex:
Well, it's certainly not the wisest choice one can make. My beliefs with this are more accurately described under premarital sex though, so

Premarital Sex:
For me I choose not to take part in sex until I am married the one person I want to give myself to…you know, there's a difference between 'losing' your virginity and 'giving' it…I intend to not simply lose it as a caught in the moment mistake. Now, for other people, I don't feel I can condemn them for their mistakes on that matter…it's not healthy and certainly shouldn't be practices regularly, but it's a fact of life…and it's nice to remember that a vow of chastity can be made after such a mistake if one wishes to follow it :)

Divorce:
This is a great tragedy of our day…but I can't say that there aren't times when one needs to get themselves out of an unhealthy situation. Divorce is the result of getting married without fully thinking through what that means…without knowing that you want to be with that person forever…so, I suppose I'm against the things that cause divorce, such as rushed or unfaithful relationships.

Masterbation:
Ick…I don't care what another does in the privacy of their own room, I just don't want to hear about it. Okay, all weirdness aside, I don't know…I think it's wrong to take it to extreme levels…and kinda wrong to seek sexual gratification from oneself…but it's not that big of a deal.

Abortion:
“I've noticed all those in favor of abortion are already born”-Reagan
It should not be legal except in extreme cases…since roughly 5% of abortions are those for rape or indangerment of the mother's life, that would be MANY saved lives…personally, I would have a child no matter the causes or consequences.

Birth Control:
I'm all for abstinence, the best form of birth control out there….and for natural family planning…and physical 'blocks' are fine. However, this has less to do with my religion as it does with the fact I'm not for using chemicals to change the cycles of my body…and that birth control typically makes it so that the womb is not a nice place for the being that has been created to grow, and thus is killing it…so 'tis abortion, not good.

Homosexual Orientation:
I think that we are all given our cross to bear, we are given temptations, but we are not required to give in to them. Homosexual tendencies are just one of those temptations, and as such, should not be given in to. And, because the scientific aspect is always good to look at, anal sex is not healthy or natural…one probably shouldn't use a fecal exit as an entrance unless they're asking for germs.

So, turns out I'm more or less against all these things…is it a bad thing to know what my morals are? Nope…that's why their my morals :)

Peace and Joy,
Alexa

Re: Judaism/Islam/Catholicism/Buddhism - which is the most tolera

okay, i'll play too…….

TEEN SEX: i lost my virginity when i was 12 and would council any teen-ager to at least be in love with the other. casual teen sex is not the best choice one can make. i speak from experience……..

PRE-MARITAL SEX: consenting adults that are in relationships where both parties are fine with it seems okay to me………

ABORTION: it should be legal as a last resort when all other options have been carefully investigated …….

BIRTH CONTROL: it seems to me that if the planet is truly over-populated then birth control should be close to mandatory. generally speaking, i would wish that children come into the world only with couples that are both dedicated to raising healthy children……..

HOMOSEXUAL ORIENTATION: i suspect we shall one day find a gene that predisposes sexual preference and end the moral debate. however, not all homosexual behavior is genetic(assuming we find that gene), choice does play a role many times…….

DIVORCE: we live in a disposable society and relationships have not been immune to this…i wish everyone could stay together but there are many good reasons to get out too. 

MASTERBATION: the natural functionings of the body are not evil!
my preference is to have sex with someone i love, but when single, ya gotta do what ya gotta do!lol 

Re: Judaism/Islam/Catholicism/Buddhism - which is the most tolera

andrew, alexa, thank you! now, what would you call your philosophical/moral  approach andrew, that is the only thing that's missing? :) We have so far Anglican, Catholic, Buddhist and … ?

Re: Judaism/Islam/Catholicism/Buddhism - which is the most tolera

i was raised secular, intuited non-duality by the time i was 20, spend a few years hangin' with jesus christians, have looked into every spiritual path there is (i think, including c.t.), and now i call my self an integral slut because i'm not philosophically attached to any one perspective….as for morality, isn't kohlberg the man?

Re: Judaism/Islam/Catholicism/Buddhism - which is the most tolera

Re: Judaism/Islam/Catholicism/Buddhism - which is the most tolera

Let us see….hmmmm….
I think the porno industry is the most tolerant religion not listed in the chart.

For myself:

Teen Sex: Should be made mandatory, and whoever has not had sex in their teens has to go to their ministers who will direct them to the communal teen sex room where a willing teen sex surrogate of any gender would help the young virgin get it on.
I myself never had sex as a teenager.
See how I turned out? Don't ask.
Also it should be illegal for anyone to have sex after their teen years.

Premarital sex: Like cat sex and bear sex, the premaritals usually have their mating season once a year. After they migrate to Hawaii for the winter it is time for nubile premaritals to engage in their dance of enticement to get the male premaritals excited, bone excited! After lots of alcohol consumption, some reefer, and listening and dancing to Barry White, premaritals usually head to the place of nuptials delight, the Paradise Motel.

Divorce: Marriage should be made illegal so that we do not have any kind of problems with people getting divorced.

Masturbation: It is okay as long as there is someone watching or ideally doing it with you. The aid of fruit, vegetables or other food items may help. I hear prunes are good. When all else fails, a cup of coffee and a cigarette usually does the trick.

Abortion: If people still doubt that 9/11 was an inside job…

Birth Control: Fool-proof birth control - only have sex with transvestites!

Homosexual Orientation: Oh that is wonderful, darling! What I don't get are these sicko trannies! Earch! Talk about unnatural!

I hope that clears up a few things around here.

Re: Judaism/Islam/Catholicism/Buddhism - which is the most tolera

Ok, I hear you - you don't like this discussion. That is ok, everyone is entitled to his or her own opinion,

love to you,

Nicole

Re: Judaism/Islam/Catholicism/Buddhism - which is the most tolera

How do I not like this discussion?

Re: Judaism/Islam/Catholicism/Buddhism - which is the most tolera

The reply is so strongly sarcastic. It has a very jarring effect in an otherwise serious and productive discussion.

What do you think?

Nicole

Re: Judaism/Islam/Catholicism/Buddhism - which is the most tolera

Oh that was my attempt at humour, sorry it jarred.
You do have to admit that nobody knows that porn is practically a religion nowadays ;p

Re: Judaism/Islam/Catholicism/Buddhism - which is the most tolera

sigh

Re: Judaism/Islam/Catholicism/Buddhism - which is the most tolera

Well, accordin to the chart Buddhism and Juaism are the most tolerant. I actually believe that all of the items listed are accepred in much of western society.

Re: Judaism/Islam/Catholicism/Buddhism - which is the most tolera

andrew, Dov, how did I miss these! once more I must thank Mr for finding these wonderful responses.

andrew, could you explain more about Kohlberg?

Dov, such clear and great answers. Thank you!

Any other takers? This is a terrific thread,

Love,

Nicole

Re: Judaism/Islam/Catholicism/Buddhism - which is the most tolera

Re: Judaism/Islam/Catholicism/Buddhism - which is the most tolera

That is a beautiful approach, Gia!

Love,

Nicole