Gaia: Co-Creating Reality ~ What Else is Possible? What the Bleep - What the Bleep Do We Know About Wealth!? - Why Bleep Knowledge, Synchronicity, Sustainability, Money NOW!!!

Re: Man-made Money is NOT functioning as Energy: End of thread

http://goodworld.gaia.com — Mon, 16 Apr 2007 17:57:33 GMT

Reading the posts in this thread has been a fascinating experience. The range/levels/depth of awareness is quite a challenge when one is looking to discover/establish consensus.

I think it is well worth preserving the discussion for future reference.

I would hate to appear controversial, but had the feeling of quite a tinge of "I'm all right Jack"-isms in some posts. Paraphrased, "I am doing so and so, and the problem of money is no problem as a result; there is no need to confront contrary powers in the world."

I would have liked to know before the thread closed how this is possible

"if we are not greedy, then we will not work as much, perhaps not work at all; this is possible i do it all my life, never worked - no no... and there is nobody paying for that either - he heee"

Re: Man-made Money is NOT functioning as Energy: End of thread

http://ClarityQuest.gaia.com — Mon, 02 Apr 2007 07:59:25 GMT

Thank you for sharing, Cheryl & Golden.

Susmita have requested that I lock this thread as she has since started her own Conscious Capitalism Pod.

I'm now thinking of what to do with this board/sub-pod.
- Delete it?
- Keep it as it is but lock all threads Susmita started?
- Rename it?
- Expand it to include discussions on both (money) fortune & fame. Since both are distractions that we must work on... (this is well... my limited view on the topic...)
- Find another moderator for this sub-pod?

What Else is Possible?

Please let me know if you have any ideas or interest in sharing your insights on money, capitalism etc.

I don't have much to share on these topics at the moment.

Re: Man-made Money is NOT functioning as Energy: End of thread

http://goldenlotus.gaia.com — Mon, 02 Apr 2007 04:47:43 GMT

I agree cheyrle even by putting out the statement man made money is not energy just speaks volumes about resistance to money. The idea that the whole world must change so that I can prosper is pure resistance. The truth is everything is here for us already it is a matter of us lining up with it. If you focus on the debt portion of money lending you are not seeing what loans build. Man made money is absolutely a functioning energy, evertime you give it to the cashier it does exactly what it was made for, that by definition is functioning the only way it does'nt function is in our experience and we can shift that at any moment.

Re: Man-made Money is NOT functioning as Energy: End of thread

http://seekerfinder.gaia.com — Sat, 31 Mar 2007 06:32:20 GMT

In a free Universe such as we live in each one of us is free to focus on what we choose to focus on. We can focus on the problems of our planet or we can focus on the solutions our planet has already come up with and continues daily to come up with. Depending on one's chosen perspective the world is going to hell in a handbasket unless someone does something right now or the world is on it's way to a beautiful recovery with more people living in abundance than in lack and is in better shape today on a global scale than it was five or ten or fifteen years ago. Depending on one's chosen perspective one can find irrefutable evidence to support either view.

The Law of Attraction dictates that like attracts like. Regardless of whether or not one believes in the Law of Attraction makes no difference because we are all existing by it even if we don't believe we are. We can't see, touch or smell oxygen and it would be very logical for anyone to say that it just simply does not exist...however regardless of whether or not we believe oxygen exists we breathe it in and out thus giving us life. Same thing goes for the Law of Attraction only it is our psychological life instead of physical life it is giving us.

Personally I would much rather focus on the things on our planet that are working so that like can attract like and more and more and more things will begin to work...more people will attract abundance to themselves...more people will focus on the blessings we all have in our lives which will attract even more blessings into our lives. I personally do not see the value of focusing on all that is wrong in the world because I do not like to attract like in that respect. No my head isn't buried in the sand...I am fully aware that there is inequality, suffering, poverty and other negative things that exist on our planet. However it is my fervent belief that as long as I focus only on what is 'wrong' that is all I will be able to see in the world and I already know that things are changing...things are improving and I prefer to support that forward movement on our planet with my energy rather than support the stagnation of poverty and suffering on our planet with my energy. What I support with my energy, with my beliefs, is reflected in the choices that I make as a human being every single day. Thoughts become things...choose the good ones.

Not making a judgment here at all. As I said it is a free Universe and we are all free to think, feel, say, do and imagine what we choose to.

In closing I would only like to say that the information being fed to us by the news media as well as well meaning organizations created to stop certain things is one-sided and specifically designed to cause us to be anxious about the state of our planet, to be fearful of others who don't subscribe to our ways and to expect the worst of everyone at all times. It comes from a place of lack and as long as coming from that place continues there is going to be lack. I have found again and again and again in my personal experience that where I focus my attention becomes the global reality for me and to be totally honest because I focus my attention on what is right with the world I am continually being presented with rock hard irrefutable evidence that we are on the right track...things are being done in a positive direction and that the paradigm shift has begun on a global scale. Where attention goes energy flows!

Blessings,
Cheryl

Re: Man-made Money is NOT functioning as Energy: End of thread

http://seek2know.gaia.com — Sat, 31 Mar 2007 02:58:57 GMT

Cheryl I congratulate you for getting out of your poor financial situation by affirmation and other positive beliefs about money. Here I am talking about our collective reality, thinking beyond me and my situation to community, region, nation and global inequality and injustice...the systemic roots of why we are in this situation. I am guessing you are asking why I am raising these questions?

Do you think it is OK, here in our United states... supposedly most prosperous country in the world the top 20% of the people owned a remarkable 84% , leaving only 16% of the asset or net worth for the bottom 80% (wage and salary workers)? or top 1% owning 40% of financial wealth leaving only 9% for bottom 80%? Yet we are spending hundreds of billions in Iraq war and trillions over the years to military-intelligence complex. From 1990 to 2005, CEOs' pay increased almost 300% (adjusted for inflation), while production workers gained a scant 4.3%. [Source: Who rules america]

One must wonder why a man made economic system has to be so grossly unfair...why wealth has concentrated in few hands and why so much of it is directed to war initiative than building a culture of peace?

Over 15 million children die of hunger every year, half a billion live in absolute poverty and over a billion live with less than a $1 a day....some say these are just statistics....others cannot stay quiet and disconnected from the world's pain and suffering....may be we need to fully connect with our pain...before we can feel for others.

Re: Man-made Money is NOT functioning as Energy: End of thread

http://seekerfinder.gaia.com — Fri, 30 Mar 2007 19:33:53 GMT

While I can see your reason for posing these questions/idea I suppose for me they hold no importance. Mainly because money has mostly in recent years been a non-issue for me. Not saying I've always had enough money to live on and yes I used to focus on money all of the time...as in focusing on my lack of money for even the basics in life. have been so poor I've been homeless and without any means of financial support whatsoever. I have literally been on the streets and have managed to get myself back together and to a place where I do not think about money. Well I do think about money sometimes but it is only to remind myself of the affirmation I created almost two years ago that I have MORE money than I need today, tomorrow and always.

Personally to me money is more often than not in our society found to be far too important and has far too much power. Here is the thing for me...we all exist in an infinitely abundant Universe and money simply is just a part of that abundance. I have found through my own personal experience that understanding, and most importantly 'believing', that I am completely deserving of all of the abundance the Universe has to offer is when I seem to have the most money. It's not just about money though...again money is simply a 'part' of the abundance that we all deserve and I truly believe that when the world realizes how truly un-important money itself is in the grand scheme of things is when everyone will have more than they need today, tomorrow and always.

This morning on the news they just reported that the U.S. Government announced a proposed budget of several trillion dollars. If you never believed in the infinite abundance of the Universe this should get you started. The budget to run this country is now in the trillions of dollars. I can remember when just a few millions blew people's minds. This is a very clear indication to me and rock solid evidence that our Universe, this planet specifically, has an infinite amount of abundance and has more than enough to go around. I feel comfortable in saying this because even though the government continuously announces budgets that blow our minds I have no less money than I had before and in fact I seem to have more and more and more people out there seem to be doing well financially. That alone should get people thinking that there is more than enough money to go around and that greed to get our share and paranoia that someone else is going to get our share is a totally ridiculous way to think or be.

Blessings,
Cheryl

Re: Man-made Money is NOT functioning as Energy: End of thread

http://seek2know.gaia.com — Thu, 29 Mar 2007 14:35:27 GMT

I am posting just to make this thread the most enaged so far on top.

Here are the questions for us to contemplate on and help us co-create
a New holistic humanistic transpersonal and human centered economy ....

1) What is money and what is its function?

2) How is money issued (comes into circulation )? Is it necessary for money to be an instrument of Debt (see what's written on your dollar bill)?

3) What is fractional reserve banking (FRB as opposed to 100% banking)?

4) What is the role and purpose of Central Bank?

5) What creates government debt (if government is minting money)?

6) What's are the problems of using debt-based currency (IOU)?

7) Who owns government (people's) debt? why taxation is necessary?

8) What is usury and how it creates invisible slavery of people and concentration of wealth in few hands?

9) Why war is an economic necessity and peace unprofitable? For whom?

10) Why do foreign trade only with one or two currency?

11) Is fiat paper or electronic money a commodity (or store of value)?

12) Why can't we easily answer any or all the above even with economists, mgmt or financial experts?

13) Who ultimately provides the financial capital needed for trade, war including civil wars, Revolutions, Dictator/Czar, monarchy, national governments, global corporations, mafia, media, think tanks, front groups, entertainment, academia, research and homeowners alike?

14) What can we learn about ourselves (human perception, psychology and mind) from the history/evolution of money?

Ok you get the idea? Follow the money back to its source (how and where it is issued? )

Just follow with curiosity and a sense of adventure and humor ;-)

PEACE

Re: Why Bleep Knowledge, Synchronicity, Sustainability, Money NOW

http://angelika.gaia.com — Tue, 03 Oct 2006 06:31:28 GMT

Thank you for your beautiful poem. I notice when I get depressed about money- not having enough to live comfortably, I push it further away by cursing it and the whole system.
I like the line about deserving the power of money. I need to learn to welcome it into my life, so that I can live in that abundance as well as all the other abundances I have (Friends, Family,Love, A great place to live, Love) because I need to eat and eat WELL! Organic foods and the superfoods I like cost a pretty penny right now!
And I must believe I deserve it, because I know how to spend it on this societies positive change!

Re: Man-made Money is NOT functioning as Energy: End of thread

http://seek2know.gaia.com — Thu, 21 Sep 2006 15:31:29 GMT

Agreed.

Let's end this thread has gotten too long. Move on to other thread and see how do we
restore balance in the massive imbalance created by our unconscious participation in a faulty monetary system..

Please take this discussion to next Thread on how do we address the reality now.

I am not sure whether everyone fully understands what Usury is? If not we can begin the next thread with that. This word has been taken of from text-books.

Re: Man-made Money is NOT functioning as Energy

http://dancingdragon.gaia.com — Wed, 20 Sep 2006 14:58:23 GMT

Yes

Re: Man-made Money is NOT functioning as Energy

Wed, 20 Sep 2006 14:54:34 GMT

yes for me too, the issue is not the money but rather how to put it in proportion on daily or overall basis

and what is the basis ? is there where we drop our collective greed !

if we are not greedy, then we will not work as much, perhaps not work at all; this is possible i do it all my life, never worked - no no

and there is nobody paying for that either - he heee

i am just not afraid to be completely poor which i am anyway

and i tell you two things, besides loosing weight, i regained my complete sense
of security that the earth whether we cultivate it a lot or effortlessly produces all the
food and nourishment that we could ever dream of

and also, the many times i had no money at all and hardly to eat were the
richest in spirit

so i don't need the rich guys to be poor so that i will get even - the thing that i feel most necessary is to take the earth out of their hands before it is too contaminated and out of balance

this all system that we play part in, whether we are millioners or poor guys who are ready to overthrow the administration -

he he this is so ridiculous -

it only makes me laugh (aloud in my heart )

come on, lets follow the spiral of evolution to and fro the source until we are free of this paradigm

i suggest you read the Handbook for the New Paradigm Grown by Argus

be poor and blessed to know that what you are left with IS not I$

Re: Why Bleep Knowledge, Synchronicity, Sustainability, Money NOW

http://rosemarie.gaia.com — Wed, 20 Sep 2006 14:40:50 GMT

Angelika~
Many years ago I wrote a poem about the Power of Money.

The Power of Money
by Rosemarie E. Bishop

I deserve the power of money;
the power to share, the power to teach,
the power to give, the power to reach.

I deserve the power of money,
the power to do what's good,
to forgive with generosity
in heaven's neighborhood.

I deserve the power of money
to do all that is right,
to show the truest way to live
and bring others into the light.

It wasn't until many years later that I began to understand what these words meant. Many of my friends have printed the poem and have it on their refrigerators to remind them that money is a good thing when it's used for goodness, but when it was written I truly did not understand why it was so important to write. Since then I have learned and I embrace the concept of the positive energy large amounts of money can spread across the planet.
In love & light....
Ro

Re: Man-made Money is NOT functioning as Energy

http://IamwhoIam.gaia.com — Wed, 20 Sep 2006 12:11:43 GMT

Hello,

This is working for me and many others; I suggest you watch The Secret and live The Secret and you will find that you too can live in not only abundance of financial wealth but also spiritual wealth. The world is changing and more and more people are becoming aware of the Secret.

Re: Money is NOT just energy!

http://Domus-ulixes.gaia.com — Wed, 20 Sep 2006 06:21:44 GMT

Maybe we should question, what we, as individuals have for an effect? Does our small budget contribute to the greater good? In halloand we have very little defence, so our taxes contribute only very little to war and so on. In america, the dutch yearly budget gets spent 4 times a year, entirely on war. Which is, in comparison to ours a lot. I will not question your will and eagerness to stop this way of spending money in america, i will on it's effectiveness. If you would look at it realisticly, (for I do not know this) What effect does you rway of life has on the bigger picture? I am not saying this to discourage you, but to show you what affect one man, can honestly achieve in a group, wheer so many do little to nothing at all.

Re: Man-made Money is NOT functioning as Energy

Wed, 20 Sep 2006 01:22:10 GMT

Well spoken RICK, I'm not into this money thing but what I am into I feel the same as you do, just talking about a problem just makes it bigger. Your Friend, Don

Re: Man-made Money is NOT functioning as Energy

http://rsw.gaia.com — Tue, 19 Sep 2006 22:08:08 GMT

Susmita, I am back to the beginning with this discussion. You are preaching to the choir - everyone in this discussion is in basic agreement with you that the current economic system is designed to enrich a relative few at the expense of the great mass of humanity. The question is what are we willing to do about it.

As I have said before, the people who control the economic system are also engaged in the process of creating the hologram of collective consciousness. They aren't going to stop just because we are on to their nefarious activity. They have many converts - not everyone believes that the current system is a bad one ("we have the greatest economy in history", they say - I've heard it many many times).

First, one must decide what is a proper course of behavior. Do we act to improve conditions within the "hologram of collective consciousness", or do we practice non-involvement? If you choose action, is it immediate action, or is it geared to long-term change? If you choose immediate action, are you truly prepared for what is required?

Let's move forward with this discussion. Assuming the current moneymind requires transformation, what do we do, how do we do it, and whose help do we need? Oh yeah, and how will we pay for it?

Re: Man-made Money is NOT functioning as Energy

http://seek2know.gaia.com — Tue, 19 Sep 2006 20:04:57 GMT

Diane (Dragon dancer) we are in agreement over quite a few things yet I diverge in significant ways.

There are two things surface understanding and deeper understanding
(one touches the surface and another seeks to go deeper). In the very start of this thread I started with the evolutionary need of current times (see video) is to dig deeper and think from whole perspective of the planetary situation, not just how we individually choose to earn or spend or invest money consciously.

Money itself is a product of collective agreement and trust. For past few centuries we have been collectively so caught up in the pursuit of material comfort and success, as well as with the trauma of wars, famines, revolutions .. we really did not have the time or will or platform to openly discuss this issue of what money is or how to design it so it fulfills our whole pursuit of life, liberty and happiness and our creative need for self-actualization than survival. The current system is not even meeting the survival needs of billions in planet.

Quoting your previous remarks and filling in (mine in bold)

If you really want to change the world ~ change how you think.

That is what we plan to do, to see how money is created, who controls the issue of money and how it is distributed/allocated. And change the very perception of money based on what we need and perhaps approaching bio-mimicry (modelling from nature) and how energy functions in nature and within human family.

You wrote, " Einstein (I think) gave a definition of insanity as Doing the same thing over an over and expecting a different result."

Yes the myriad problems and gross inequalities we see in the world is insane and due to the insane way the current monetary system (a legacy of colonnial times) is functioning.

You wrote:
"Money is just a physical means to facilitate exchanging our energy. How you use it it up to you.we are in control and responsible for how our work energy/money is used or hoarded. You choose. It really is not difficult. Just stay alive and pay attention."

The physical money came from the idea of Money which is abstract. And like all ideas takes shape in our mind and perception. As our consciousness expands and deepens, so also our very perception, definition and physical expression and design of money. When our perception shifts and reaches critical mass, the outer reality shifts without any need of armed struggle. When all of humanity dreams the same dream, reality shifts instantly.

Follow the money. It is just an exchange but has no real power of it's own. Where it come from and where it goes (which we, each of us, do control) is where the real power is.

If you follow the money it is accumulating in fewer hands and simultaneously going to funding of war-intelligence-military complexes, most notably here in USA. Money in few hands has become the very instrument of creating conditions ripe for corruption, war, racism, violence and loss of real security and real freedom.

Distribution of World Income (UN Human Development Report)

¶ Richest 20 percent of the World's Population: 85 % (up from 75 % over the past 30 years)

¶ Poorest 20 percent of the World's Population: 1.4 % (down from 2.3 % over the past 30 years)

Annual Cost of Alleviating Poverty (UN Human Development Program)

For Food, Clean water, Clothes, Education, Health Care & Sanitation for 4.4 billion people: $60 billion

For Food and Basic Health Care for 4.4 billion people: $19.5 billion

What Americans and Europeans spend annually on pet food: $25 billion (for comparison)

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Third World Debt: $2000 billion (up from $100 billion 30 years ago) (UN's World Development Report)

¶ Debt Payments Flowing from the Poor to the Rich Countries: approx 1400 billion (from 1960 to 1993)

¶ Foreign Aid Flowing from the Rich to the Poor Countries: approx 140 billion (from 1960 to 1993)

Percentage of Foreign Aid that Reaches the Poor in the Poor Countries: approx 5 %

Foreign Aid Given by Canada as a Percentage of GDP: .29 % (.09 % for U.S.)

Source: Link

3 billion of world 's people live in poverty with income under $2 a day, I billion are children and about 1.3 billion of them are women.

Commercial Banks legally create money out of thin air under fractional reserve system, and we pay compound interest on it. "If you wish to remain the slaves of Bankers and pay the cost of your own slavery, let them continue to create deposits." - Sir Josiah Stamp, President of the Bank of England in the 1920's, the second richest man in Britain

Now do you see why we need to collectively engage to rethink money and change the system, despite what we have been conditioned to think and believe about what money or capitalism is. This is needed for planetary survival. If we cannot take care of our own human species, how are we going to save the environment, climate or other living things? We need to think beyond me, my family, religion, race or country here.

Should we not at least wonder who owns all these Debts? And who are being in-debt or under control? How did we come to this kind of situation? How deep the rabbit hole goes? Now lets come back to the empty drawing board. Shall we?

Re: Money is NOT just energy!

http://dancingdragon.gaia.com — Mon, 18 Sep 2006 21:26:44 GMT

I do. I know where the money I entrust to others goes (including insurance companies) . If there is not full disclosure that particular institution does not get my money.

Taxes I have less control over. Part of my money goes toward the tuition of individuals that can't afford it-a good thing and part to wars I don't support-a bad thing. So I make sure to stay informed and I vote to keep for those individuals that I think make better decisions for all of us.

I choose what I do. I am not responsible, nor do I speak, for any 'other' people. I choose to take responsibility for my actions (including my money) no matter what anyone else chooses to do.

I do have the power to pay attention to my part of the whole. Enough ones added together make a trillion.

I choose to focus on a new way of doing things and not 'business as usual'.

Aloha & Nameste

Re: Money is NOT just energy!

http://Domus-ulixes.gaia.com — Mon, 18 Sep 2006 21:14:25 GMT

My life insurance is paid 60 percent by myself, and due to the fact I'm a student, the other 40 percent by the state. Furthermore, since I earn too little money, I get 40 percent of my college money paid by the state, the rest I pay by myslef or I get from my parents.
My money mostly stays within the european union. And I do not exactly know where it goes. (who does?)
And no power? How many people do the crazyest things, just for the chance of having some money...

Re: Money is NOT just energy!

http://dancingdragon.gaia.com — Mon, 18 Sep 2006 19:30:53 GMT

I too am not much of a "consumerist" (as I understand your meaning) and do not get myself in debt. If you do not go into debt you are contributing to a change...

Your 'life insurance' where does it come from and where does it go?

Where do you get your money? I assume it has to come from someones labor.The places you put your money...what do they use it for?

Follow the money. It is just an exchange but has no real power of it's own. Where it come from and where it goes (which we, each of us, do control) is where the real power is.